How can paintball grow if the perception is tainted

[VonBraun63]

Quick back story. Just moved to New Orleans area and was looking for fields to play at and teams to play against/with. Came across this nugget of a witch hunt just outside of Baton Rouge.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.theadvocate.com/baton_rouge/news/article_55697bb4-d53a-11eb-9217-0bc03c32f40e.amp.html

https://m.youtube.com/watch?fbclid=IwAR1K1YqNrgJ0sPDrPolnBXBEliVhego8X6o18ZHnWQLeu-ijjg_7UvkJPaQ&v=leDVoKG013s&feature=youtu.be

I know the YouTube video of the Parish Committee meeting is a little long but this New field owner is being railroaded.

[JonM]

I don’t think it’s fair to say that people’s perception of paintball is tainted based upon a single field’s issues. The article doesn’t go too deep into it, but it sounds like there may have been other circumstances that caused the field to be targeted. I just don’t have enough background information to make an educated call in this case. Generally speaking, most fields I know of haven’t had to put up with such things.

[Chuck E Ducky]

It sounds like it was noise complaints from surrounding houses. Lots of things run into these issues. Like people who build there house next to an airport or race track then make it there mission to complain about planes flying over there house or noise from race cars. It depends on the town if the complaints are entertained. Only way to fix that is to vote and get involved with your local government.

[Junglepeanut]

My wife played at an arena soccer field for years (converted roller hockey rink) then they built expensive apartments towering over it. People moved in and complained about the lights and the noise and they forced the field to close even though it was there long before. Seems completely idiotic to me but what do I know

[Chuck E Ducky]

Happens all the time. My favorite drag strip got shut down by Karens. Now kids are getting killed street racing go figure. The small airport I fly out of can only leave and return in a certain direction regardless of safety concerns. Because a bunch of Karen’s from the city moved in built houses at the end of an airport runway. So far a few small planes have ended up in the Hudson. Just a matter of time before the local dirt track gets shut down they are always battling the flow of clowns fleeing the city that bought up all the houses of people leaving NY for less taxed states. They got the local dirt bike spot shut down already. The only public free boat launch we have outsiders trying to get shut down because people are mad that trucks are going in there early during Stryper season.

[Hp_lovecraft]

Like people who build there house next to an airport or race track then make it there mission to complain about planes flying over there house or noise from race cars

A common issue here in Maine is shooting ranges. Maine law exempts shooting ranges from noise ordnances, if the range range was opened before the rules went into effect. and more are since most were formed in the 1800s.

But lots of towns want to shut them down anyway. Too many Karens. So a tactic sometimes used is to get the area around the shooting range declared a wildlife preserve, then have the EPA say the range is somehow damaging the environment... presto.... shutdown.

The same tactic was used to shut down Coram Paintball. They had, maybe, the nicest field I've ever played in. Tons of structures, vehicles, helicopters, etc, but not too spread out. I loved it. Shut down via the EPA trick, then bulldozed and condos built.

Paintball doesnt have the bad image it had in the 80s. I would often get pulled over when I left a paintball field back in 1990 to check for "illegal weapons". It has been more of a game/sport for many years. But it can often have a party atmosphere... and that kind of thing is always going to piss some people off

[eddie]

Cousins in Coram got turned into a bike park which is actually pretty fun to ride, but of course the field was better.

[Hp_lovecraft]

Yes, the field itself was converted into a bike park. But the field itself was FORCED to close by corrupt politicians who wanted the adjacent lots built into a high-end gated community "Country Pointe Homes" for which they had a financial stake in, It was a big scandal 15 years ago. The politicians had no power to shut them down directly, so they had the land declared a 'Nature Preserve", and used EPA tricks to close them. They used the same trick to shut down a nearby shooting range, despite being grandfathered. But thats politics.

[VonBraun63]

“don’t think it’s fair to say that people’s perception of paintball is tainted based upon a single field’s issues.”

Definitely not saying people’s perception. Just the image in general. The owner went through all avenues to get his field opened. Covid shut him down for a year. When he reopened the field took off to a point that he was “in a good way” struggling to keep up.
The adjoining neighbors, farmers and land owners didn’t like the extra noise, people, atmosphere, image and the county/parish started to ask for permits, land surveys,EPA tags, Fire Marshall approvals ect. All things he had complied with 2 years earlier and the parish past for him to open. To be fair there are some things that the owner is at fault for but not to a point that a cease and assist had to issued because he couldn’t comply with the demands of the county and parish.

[Siress]

Good grief, folks. Be clear and concise in your communication. Let's summarize the events rather than passing judgement and expecting everyone to blindly agree with it...

King (Field owner) applies for residential building permits with intent to use the structures for commercial purposes. Livingston Parish gov't bungles issuance of building/zoning permits to King without due dillagence. Adjacent residents to the field protest loudly. Parish Council district president Ard publicly proclaims "it's not my job. It's not this council's job. We don't have the authority to take [the Cease and Desist] away." Ard points the finger at Mr. Rick's of Parish Dept. of Transportation and Development (DOTD). DOTD points the finger at Federal Dept. of Health and Human services. DHH has valid cause to shutter the business owing to lack of proper procedures to bring the site up to code, and provided a informal remediation strategy as such processes are governed by the Parish Council. Those procedures were not initiated initially because the property owner had falsified applications for building and zoning. Those personally invested in the matter feel slighted and protest loudly, despite the clear and persistent violations.

"Never attribute to malice what can more easily be explained by incompetence."
In this case, there's plenty to go around on all sides of the table. Personally, I find the Field Owner most at fault for falsifying building/zoning requests for permit. Eventually, I think the owner will need to decide if it's worth paying to correct the mistakes he caused, or if he needs to shutter indefinitely and sell what he can.

For those that want the long version:
Relevant part of the video starts @36:04. Perhaps the best summary is here: @62:47; after which I stopped watching because nothing else seems relevant beyond this.

• Paintball Field ("field") Owner (King) v. Parish Council (Namely District 1 Pres. Ard)
• Field is set between two residential areas.
• Field development timeline per the planning office representative (mostly):
  • 2019-03-01: King filed for an LLC business license. As of 2021-06-24 the state finds King's business in "poor standing" with revocation date set at 2022-03-01.
  • 2019-03: King purchased the land, located in District 1, in Mar 2019
    • King excavated the property to level it and redirect runoff water to keep the property dry.
  • 2019-05-07: Planning and Zoning rec'd first complaint of illegal operations on site.
  • 2019-05-22: Planning spoke with contracts on the site, presumably informing them of such violations. King was not present.
  • 2019-06: King informed the council in June 2019 after such work was completed.
    • A third party reviewed the draining plan and stated 'as long as no one complains, there doesn't appear to be an issue.'
  • 2019-06-12: King applied for a RESIDENTIAL SHED permit, and a TRAILER permit.
  • 2019-06-17: Planning visited the site and spoke with King. King shared that he was planning a paintball field. Planning advised King that he needed to contact the Planning Committee.
  • 2019-06-24: In the preliminary meeting, King stated he would only operate the business from 10am-5pm on Saturdays.
  • 2019-07-29: King rec'd his first occupational license.
    • Councilman Walkem (sp?) of District 4 (not D1 where the business is located) granted King a business permit for the field. A questionable issuance IMO.
    • Ard was not consulted prior to granting of the business permit. As of 2021-06-24, Ard motions for King to have a 6mo provisional permit granted but lacks the power to overrule the federal agencies.
  • 2019-08-13: King issued a letter to stop all work since the development had not been approved.
  • 2019-09- ~20: Hang tag left on site advising King that he needed to return to the Planning Committee.
  • 2019-09-30: Preliminary meeting was held where it was noted that a PORTABLE BUILDING had been added to the site under a RESIDENTIAL permit.
  • 2019-10-15: King finally applied for COMMERCIAL development through the planning office.
  • 2019-11-06: "they" were supposed to go through planning but did not prove that the sign was erected before 2019-10-28, so it was delayed.
  • 2019-12-04: "they" went through planning and
  • 2019-12-05: Council approved the final site plan.
  • 2019-12-10: King was sent a letter for the review fee. "Normally Sam doesn't sign-off [on the review plan] unless the review fee is paid."
  • 2020-10: Past due notice sent to King.
  • 2020-11: It is assumed that review fee was then paid as 'Sam signed off on the final site plan at that time.'
  • 2021-03: "Thomas" was informed that the Field had been operating without final "CO" approval.
  • 2021-02-23: Inspection report indicated that the site needed a final inspection.
  • 2021-02-25: King rec'd another occupational license.
  • 2021-03-01: Final inspection scheduled for 2021-03-04.
  • CONFLICT OF STORY
    • King presented:
      • 2021-03-15: King informed that a final inspection had not been performed as had been required of the Parish to perform.
        • Inspection indicated that a fence may need to be installed if residents complained.
    • Planning office presented:
      • 2021-03-15: Final inspection report rec'd indicating that fencing wasn't required, but that residential complains would merit installation of them.
  • 2021-03-15: King marketed a 'Friday night lights' event in conflict with the Saturdays 10am-5pm agreement.
  • 2021-04-17: Evidence provided showing that patrons were consuming alcohol on site.
  • 2021-04-27: Other complaints and pictures being provided. (Editors note (EN): Cryptic here... same person? ...valid complaints?)
  • 2021-05-01: Picture provided of "them" blocking the servitude(?), an illegal act.
  • 2021-05-02: Pictures provided showing inadequate parking, destruction of highway signage (EN: Relevant how?), mud holes, trash, portable toilets, and paintballs littering the property.
  • 2021-05-04: Dept. of Health (DHH) gets involved naming 3 violations: fixtures, responsible parties, and discharging.
  • 2021-05-06: King informed that the developments on site were likely beyond the scope of what had been permitted.
  • 2021-05-10: Meeting held regarding complaints.
  • 2021-05-17: Another committee meeting held regarding complaints. King set his operational hours as Saturday from 9am-5pm and Sunday from 1-5pm.
  • 2021-05-19: Dept. of Justice, American's with Disabilities Act office sent an email noting the difference between approved plans and what was actually constructed on site.
  • 2021-05-24: Morgan (ugh...) sent an email noted some/all additional requirements needed "because of the size of their business."
  • 2021-05-25: Sam "decided to issue a Cease and Desist order".
  • 2021-06-06/07: Meetings with ?
  • 2021-06-12: Planning rec'd pictures of business occurring on site after C&D issued.
  • 2021-06-17: DHH rec'd a letter complaining about sewage treatment on site.
  • 2021-06-21: DHH stated that no action was required on their part due to the C&D order. The owner must submit plans a site map, info about food/water/etc, in order to size sewer.
  • 2021-06-22: RESIDENTIAL SHED permit REVOKED since the shed was being used as a commercial development.
  • 2021-06-24: Fire Marshal and Planning noted that no inspection of the parking area had been performed to confirm compliance with the ADA regulations that apply to businesses.

King's side of it:

• Time unknown:
  • Local residents complained about...
    • noise
    • public indecency
    • public urination
    • patrons disrupting local traffic while on foot
    • patrons driving upon residential property to access the business and potentially damaging said property.
      • King addressed this by getting a larger sign.
• Dept. of Health filed a complaint that the business did not provide adequate bathrooms on site.
• Dept. of Ag. filed a complaint that the owner built a pond with runoff without proper assessment or permits.
• King did not address any of these complains, or such remediations were left out of the article.
  • In the video, he says he's willing to do so and asks for time to do it. Duration unclear.
• 2021-05: King informed by "Mr. Sam" of the Parish that the original site plan didn't indicate parking on site as it exists.
  • King provide a site plan showing that the site plan indicated parking as it exists on the site.
  • Sam claimed that the engineer didn't provide such a plan to the Parish. Ordinance indicated that such parking must be paved.
  • Sam informed King that the fence and additional netting are required to continue operating.
  • Sam informed King that Cody (a resident adjacent to the business) needed to be consulted to approve the fencing and netting.
  • Dept. of Transportation and Development (DOTD) consulted regarding judgement on the driveway/parking.
  • Sam shuttered the business with a cease and desist (C&D) order without explanation.
  • King assumed this was to be lifted after remediation of the presented issues and continues work to close them out.
  • Sam informs King that King will need to go back through the Zoning Comity to lift the C&D, and that the process will take months.
• 2021-06-06: Sam informs King that he will lift the C&D if he continues to work toward remediation, and if the council is in agreement.
• 2021-06-07: At council meeting, the council issued the following plan and King estimated ~$35k for the work (in addition to the ~$15k for the fencing/netting already installed). King stated the Field needed to be open so he would agree to the work.
  • draining impact surveys,
  • DOTD driving permit,
  • topological surveys,
  • Later that afternoon, King informed that the C&D couldn't be lifted because the state was issuing the C&D based on the lack of restrooms.
    • King had existing permission from the State to continue operating while building adequate facilities.

[sniper97]

This has been my fear for years, people build next to paintball fields and then don't want to live next to a paintball field

[Siress]

FYI - That didn't happen in OPs case.

[Ecapnation]

A common issue here in Maine is shooting ranges. Maine law exempts shooting ranges from noise ordnances, if the range range was opened before the rules went into effect. and more are since most were formed in the 1800s.

But lots of towns want to shut them down anyway. Too many Karens. So a tactic sometimes used is to get the area around the shooting range declared a wildlife preserve, then have the EPA say the range is somehow damaging the environment... presto.... shutdown.

The same tactic was used to shut down Coram Paintball. They had, maybe, the nicest field I've ever played in. Tons of structures, vehicles, helicopters, etc, but not too spread out. I loved it. Shut down via the EPA trick, then bulldozed and condos built.

Paintball doesnt have the bad image it had in the 80s. I would often get pulled over when I left a paintball field back in 1990 to check for "illegal weapons". It has been more of a game/sport for many years. But it can often have a party atmosphere... and that kind of thing is always going to piss some people off

There isn't any condos there I actually live not too far away from there now and frequented deli in the area. The irony is it's still what it was the bums just moved into the old abandoned field buildings and now it's basically bike trails and hiking trails with a drug problem.

Irony of the Town lost a lot of business the field and then moving out to calverton and now they are getting chased out as well by a solar farm