CO2 Tank with an HPA reg

[Cdn_Cuda]

In my latest bundle of gear I found a 20oz CO2 bottle with a 3000k reg on it. Never seen this done before. I’m going to take the reg off and switch it onto a different bottle. Can’t see this being a good thing to do, is it?

Also got a good 50/4500 bottle with SLP reg, Tippmann A5 RT, Azodin KP2 with hush bolt and a spare Azodin 2-finger frame. So a pretty nice score, especially as it was only found so that I could sell someone the KP2 pump.

[SignOfZeta]

Ha! Yeah, that sounds like a bad idea.

[BrickHaus]

I bought a gearbag a while back. The old owner had 2 tanks that were 3k bottles, but they had co2 valves on em.

The one tank was full of co2 too. he said he filled his own back in the day.

[DocsMachine]

Some of the very first screw-in tanks you could buy, were 20-oz CO2 tanks, with a reg with an 1800 psi burst disc. The regs were intended to let a field, that might have hundreds of CO2 tanks already, easily and cheaply convert to HPA.

A CO2 tank is perfectly legal and capable of 1800 psi, and a 20-ouncer so filled will easily give a Pro-Lite, Carbine or Model 98 well over 200 shots. Perfect for a renter.

Keeping in mind that back then (circa '97) the absolute cheapest HPA system you could buy still cost $250, and attached to the gun with a cradle. Which of course wouldn't work for a Pro-Lite, which at the time was by far one of the most popular rental guns. A Nitro Duck 1800 reg, on the other hand, retailed at $75, and I'm sure could have been bought in bulk for even less.

And even today, you can take any reg and use it on a CO2 tank, as long as the burst disc is appropriately rated.

(All of the aforementioned does not, of course,preclude the idea that some moron slapped a 3K reg on the tank, and filled a CO2 bottle with 3K air a dozen times, not realizing he was holding a hand grenade with a loose pin.)

Doc.

[Jonnydread]

We do this for outlaw sometimes since most of us prefer CO2, as long as you understand the safety measures/checks it's fine.

[Hp_lovecraft]

Most co2 tanks today are rated at 3000psi wp. Not the 1800 wp that was common in the 90s. In that case, I don’t see any issue as long as you know what you are doing

i wouldn’t use it with co2 though. If liquid gets downstream, you would see crazy spikes

[MrBarraclough]

Is there enough safety margin there? Aren't actual 3000psi HPA tanks designed to withstand something like 5000psi? Or are 3K rated CO2 tanks actually capable of withstanding >150% of their working pressure as well?

[un2xs]

Is this an accurate statement? On fire extinguishers it is my understanding that the tanks are hydro'd at three times operating pressure.
Being able to pass a hydro at 3k is not necessarily the same as being rated for 3k. High pressure vessels are serious business.

[Chappy]

YA, if the tank is rated for 3000 than it is fine, but if its only 1800 than no bueno. This goes for the burst disc as well. Being sure to limit them to 1800 psi would be perfectly safe, but I wouldn't feel comfortable as that could lead to someone filling to the psi on the reg out of ignorance.

[ChoSanJuan]

I tend to echo what everyone else is saying... There's a certain level of safety there, especially with lower rated tanks. This also makes me think of this video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fiDmp1HkHK8

[Chappy]

Damn, that kid is a rebel!

[lew]

Shoebox Shocker owners would fill an 88 or 114 ci tank with CO2 back in the day. Even with that gas hog, you're looking at over a case a fill. The Max Flo regulators were specifically advertised as CO2 and HPA compatible. Even a 3000 psi HPA tank can easily accommodate a full CO2 fill.

[Hp_lovecraft]

[QUOTEIs there enough safety margin there? Aren't actual 3000psi HPA tanks designed to withstand something like 5000psi? Or are 3K rated CO2 tanks actually capable of withstanding >150% of their working pressure as well?][/QUOTE]

There are lots of different ways to test "pressure" of a vessel.
The number you see marked on co2 and hpa tanks is the "max working pressure". That is the max PSI that the tank would be safe, well within safety margins.

Then there is the "max burst pressure". That is the pressure that the tank burst when tested under ideal conditions. This is typically double the "max working pressure", depending on material. The difference between max WORKING and max BURST is because tanks normally weaken over time, due to thermocycle stress, and physical damage, etc. This gap exists as a margin of error. Since you have no way of knowing what the actual failure point would be on a used tank.

This is what hydrotesting is testing. They are overpressuring the tank and checking the expansion amount to see if the tank has become too weak due to use/damage/etc

Co2, normally, is around 800psi, but because it is stored as a liquid, and is temperature critical, it can easily jump to 2000psi on a hot day. In the 90s, this meant blown bursts discs all summer, every day. So the industry switched to 3000psi tanks. No more burst discs.

The different standards can cause confusion. Considere macroline. Most is rated around 500psi "max working pressure". But, technically, it has a "max burst pressure" around 1000psi. So when people would sell it, guess which number they would use? some would even use "max tensile pressure", which is meaningless, and some sellers *cough* macrolineguy *cough* would use that.

just know the difference, and if you are not sure, be safe, and just use factory installed gear

[MrBarraclough]

I never blew a burst disc in the 90s but I did have a microline setup on my Automag briefly (before macroline was common). Blew some microline between games sitting in the sun one day. I immediately went back to braided steel, which I still have on that mag today.

[Ghille-Man]

Want to sell that azodin pump?

[Cdn_Cuda]

Already sold. Actually had a buyer for it before I even bought the gun. I did keep the single trigger frame for it though. The original ASA had bad threads and mangled the SLP tank’s bonnet threads. The double frame I could mount and ASA on easier than the single trigger frame.