How To Deal With Bad Apples?

[Meleager7]

As you may have noticed, I like to pick MCB's collective brain, to get all the cumulative experience and opinions. And I continue with this today!

This topic has probably been beaten to death before, but what strategies have you guys used in the past to deal with Bad Apples, who show up to the paintball field, intent on ruining everyone's day?

Yesterday, I went to a small MCB meetup at a nearby field in Ontario, Canada . The three of us goofed around a bit on their speedball field in the first part of the morning as we waited for more walkons to arrive, etc.

A decent group of walkon renters showed, but separate from them also showed up the 2 Bad Apple gun owners.

Basically, the Bad Apples were playing with Electros and clearly shooting upcapped semi, and walking their triggers.

They were lighting up renters , and good ol' MCB'ers alike !!!!

It really ruined the fun.

Our small MCB group told them off at different times, but I think it just made their behavior worse.

Our Ref, who in spite of being a cool guy when chatting with us in the staging area, was a real Paper Tiger out there when it came to actually reffing the action. He barely warned them and we did see him talk to them afterwards but it was too little, too late. The second they started massively overshooting our players, the Ref should have pulled them from the game right then and there!!! Very frustrating!

I thought about reporting them to the Owner, but I do think they might be regulars themselves, and I am a new Member at this field, and I don't want to get an early reputation as a tattle tale or rat, or what have you.....

I probably could have squeezed in 1 more round without pressing my luck too much (I did have other obligations that afternoon ), but called the day short at that point, due to those jerks!

Anyhow, what happened yesterday is old news, and I am over it , but I would like some strategies for if this happens next time .....

Thanks Boyz!

M7

[BenoitOWN]

Switch your gear up and make it your mission to eliminate them on the field.

[Meleager7]

I did try that, not switching out gear , but focusing on the one troublemaker that lit me up earlier. I could hear his 15 ish bps fire on the other side of the field, so I moved there. I found him, and I longballed from my position, and sent a volley of about 7-8 shots with my pre-2k cocker, and maybe 2-3 landed . He did not like that. It was a 2 life game on a small field, he respawns and immediately comes after me, firing that gun as fast as he can at me , pins me down. He does a big wide suicide sweep out from cover to his right ( and my left), but I’m waiting for him. We trade, me again 6-7 shots to his 20 , and maybe two of my shots land, and so do two of his. I felt like the winner in that encounter, and a slight bit of satisfaction but man, still not not fun! I’d rather not play with guys like that at all.

[Nish]

Be honest with the staff about your experience and tell the ref that you aren't interested in playing with those people.
Talk to the renters and tell them that you are happy to take them and a ref out to play if they don't want to deal with that kind of behavior.

[Meleager7]

I really like this idea of rallying like minded renters together , who would not be having much fun anyway, and simply excluding those jerks would be amazing outcome....the best medicine for them would be to have to sit there twiddling their thumbs because no one would play with them. Like Toestr said below, the field mgmnt would have to back me up. Although I feel the Ref we had would not, I feel the Owner would, you can tell he really cares about everyone having a good time. Plus, he can’t fix anything if he doesn’t know about it. I’ll definitely be having a conversation with him, and trying this next time

[Toestr]

I've reffed in the past. I'm a younger guy so dealing with older people, especially groups of people who aren't the most kosher is always intimidating. However, the number one reason I was hesitant to or didn't speak with/chew out/eject was that I didn't think I'd be backed up by management. Either because they wouldn't care ("It's part of the game") or they wouldn't want to jeopardize selling their couple cases a weekend rather than doing right by the others.

Once I was rebalancing teams/rules before switching sides on a very one sided field because the one team got destroyed in the game prior (not necessarily because of the way the players played, but the nature of the field). Anyway, this group of guys on the team that lost before was whining because they took the loss personally and wanted the chance to do the same to the other team. Anyway they started to get up in my face and I eventually conceded. Later that in the year the same group of guys got into a physical altercation with a player over something that was probably equally as trivial, and one of the group almost bashed the guy in the head with his tank. As I suspected, management took no real action other than break up the fight. I don't recall seeing that group of players around after though.

As far as what you can do, not much I don't think other than what others have suggested in whipping out your newest electro and make it your mission to give them a taste of their own medicine. The ideal solution would be multiple groups for various experience levels/play styles/intensities of play. But that's obviously a field decision.

Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk

[punkncat]

I have seen this type of behavior many times. I feel it's honestly a shortcoming of the owner of the field not to control it. IMO the ref is only going to do as much as the owner will allow or back.
At one of our local fields there is no walking the trigger or ramping in open play, period. Games used to get broken up into "slow" and "fast" markers but at times there just aren't enough people there to have a division of the players. I suspect this issue was the root of your problems.
Another of the local fields is the freaking wild west. It is super common to go there and have all the tourney team guys, experienced players, regulars on one side and all the walk ons and renters to the other. It's been more than ridiculous and I just don't support them with my money any longer.

I feel that people like that need to go find a practice or scrimmage to be involved in. Perhaps their existence sucks so much they have to go pick on folks to feel accomplished...

[ATBen]

Grab your fastest gun and start blatantly wiping their hits off. It'll get heated, hopefully they blow-up and get booted while you look like the hero.

[Axel]

If management won't do anything about it then I caution you against beating your head against that particular brick wall. Modifying other peoples' behavior is a fool's errand

[Shaftski]

Unless the rules of play set out for that day are being broken, mgmt probably isn't doing anything.

If field rules have ROF limits and they are being broken, notify the refs. If refs won't act, speak to owner. State clearly that the rules on the waiver you signed are not being followed by other players. All players are bound to those rules for safety/insurance reasons. If the field is ROF limited, and some clown hits a rental at 15+BPS close range and rental gets hurt....Is your insurance covering that? Be calm and logical. Plus other rentals that see that go down aren't coming back to your field, and may not want to ever play again anywhere else. Nothing but bad for the sport.

Fighting fire with fire can escalate tensions in a hurry, so if that's your plan you need to be prepared for anything that might happen after that. Always take the high road and walk away if things get hostile.

[Tinybear]

In hind sight. I wish I walked up to them and congratulate them on how awesome they’re ramping “skills” were against all those renters and old farts. And add in Maybe next time it may actually help you win. Maybe a bit of patronizing embarrassment would have better effect than the legit reasoning, but I suppose that could make things that much worse.

I think the biggest thing we could have done was see if the others would rather play without them. And then simply ask. But I suppose in grand scheme it’s up to the ref and owner to do the right thing. Sadly that didn’t quite happen while we where there.

[Meleager7]

There are actually some awesome refs there, there’s the older dude with the short beard, he was with the private group of teen and parents. He carries a megaphone, and often yells through it “ I’m not mad at you, but put your f’ing mask down!!” He is a great Ref. The owner does an excellent job, as well, when he refs occasionally.

I think embarrassment is a powerful tool. Especially if you can get the crowd behind you! That’s usually a good way to deal with bullies, which is basically who these guys were.

I still stand by my comment that the regular “Regulars” are actually really cool, and don’t overshoot , in spite of having spaceguns. I don’t know where our two particular douchebags rolled in from...from under a rock somewhere I guess!

On a side note, you and Jordan have me really looking at my pump guns right now! I wish I had a pump with me during the 1v1v1 battle! Should we organize a 3 v3 or more GTA MCB pump game? I bet we could get ATBen Toestr Boddah2 Ratzo Third of Five fat-50- ? Can you think of anyone else?

[Tinybear]

That sounds fun

[Jordan]

I don't want to face Ratzo with a pump. He's deadly.

[freedom]

at a minimum, you could've asked the ref to split them up; one on each team.
if they didn't want to split up, then you can escalate to say you don't want them in with you and the renters.
be very persistent and go right to the owner if the ref is lame. i'm an old fart, too but i didn't come out to play against d-bags.

[Cdn_Cuda]

I think this is a good idea. They keep playing like that, sit out and tell them and the refs why. A-holes can either play by themselves or play nice.

[infamoussmiley]

Organize EVERYONE to hunt them down first. Team work can do wonders. And sorry. You play a sport that breeds assholes.

Best,

Smiley

[SignOfZeta]

If both of those guys were on the same team then the field sucks and you have every right to complain. Don’t be a wimp about it. Being the kind of jerk I am, I would verbally harass the two players, probably, but complaining as a customer is the more correct choice. If they really are overshooting repeatedly then the refs are seeing it. If they aren’t seeing it they are sucky refs, if they are seeing it and not dealing with it they are sucky refs. Either way the place has sucky refs and a paintball place with sucky refs just straight sucks. If there is an alternative, go there. Without refs you may as well be playing renegade woodsball with strangers.

If you were all at the roller skating place and two guys were doing Olympic grade lap times all day they’d be told to slow down. If you were playing in a community soccer league and got chumped from behind over and over by the same guys the ref would calibrate. Optimist softball, open track days, etc etc, many things like this require some oversight and management and it’s perfectly acceptable for the people participating in the event to provide feedback. Use professional language with an emphasis on safety, fairness and that “growing the sport” stuff. They’ll listen. Don’t use names. The only threat should be to go elsewhere. Use that as a last resort and don’t bluff.

At Hell Survivors they have no ROF cap that I know of and for some reason this has never been an issue when I was playing there. I think you have to cultivate a culture of fair play or the jerks will do whatever they want.

[Meleager7]

And of course two days later, taking a slight variation of what TinyBear suggested, I think of the perfect comment I should have said to those cheaters: “ hey, why don’t you guys turn down those guns to 5.5 , and let’s see if you’re actually any good? “

It’s a combination of embarrassment and an open challenge

If they actually agreed, and even hunted me down and eliminated me for the rest of the day, i’d be 100% ok with that because the game would actually be competitive at that point, I wouldn’t get that shot up, and everyone would be having fun again!

[Grendel]

Bring to the attention of the field staff and "freeze" them out of games if they persist. If you freeze them out their playing group will continue to shrink until no one will play with them and they'll move on somewhere else. If the staff does not address then vote with your wallet and move to another venue.

You can not change others behavior you can only show by example how you are to behave. They will either notice and modify their behavior for themselves or ignore the problem and lose their ability to play.

[Chuck E Ducky]

I step to them after the game. Usually something along the lines of “hay man we got a lot of new players out here today mind going a lil easy on em” two responses happen they get worse or they get better.

I have a hard time not torching them back every chance I get. But if it’s really bad I make it my mission to put as much paint on them as I can. This for sure escalates the situation. Often not the best way of handling it. People who can’t take suggestion and are out to hurt people often don’t take spoonfuls of there own medicine well.

I have had people call me out because I asked them to tone it down. Actually got the game following it on camera eliminating him with one shot to the center of his lens with my stock class marker. He packed his stuff and went home after I embarrassed him and of corse rubbed it in at the staging area. It was very satisfying. I have seen him since and his demeanor has changed for the better. He’s actually very respectful now and plays with us regularly.

Most good refs will see the issue and address it. Good field owners will back there staff as well. Rentals that get all shot up close range never come back to the sport. That can be costly especially if they share there negative experience with others.