What parts do I need to make a Hardline?

[Euphie]

So I want to get Stainless steel hardlines on my Automag RT, and I figure that I can probably get the parts from McMaster Carr but, I am a bit lost as to what to actually buy. I assume I need a 1/8” NPT compression fitting of some sort but then do I need separate ferrules? And what sort of size do I need not to compromise flow rates?

[BrickHaus]

You need a tubing cutter, and flaring tool as well.

I think 1/8" ss tubing is fine. Then 2x compression fittings and 2x ferrules.

Well, some fittings you dont need ferrules if you have the flaring tool.

[DocsMachine]

Quick and easy: Look up Swagelok, Parker A-lok or Yor-Lok. It's stainless instrument tubing that uses a compression ferrule- no flaring necessary. 3/8" has a working pressure of something like 5,000 psi, and a burst of like 15,000.

1/8" tubing would be ideal for something like a stock-class Phantom. 3/8" is kind of overkill for anything but an old gas-hungry 'shoebox' Shocker. RT's used 1/4" (though a different brand of fitting.) 1/4" is perfect for almost any marker- unless you wind up with thick wall tubing, you'll actually have a bit more bore size than typical "macro" line.

I've been plumbing stuff with Swagelok for years. Here's the world-famous Mountain Dew Shocker, with 3/16" stainless from the unregged 3K bottle on the drop to the Max Flow, and 1/4" from the Max into the gun. The trigger giard is made from 1/4" too.



Here's a similar setup, except for CO2, with a Vigilante on one of my custom ASAs. (And custom trigger guard, custom trigger, custom air-assist, power switch, 9V mod... there was a lot you could do to one of those things back then. )



And here's a CO2 'Mag I set up back in... '97 I think. I always liked how that one came out.



Doc.

[Grendel]

Thanks for beating me to it Doc. I have been a super fan of Swagelok (and later iterations from competition) since my days in the Navy doing instrumentation. Tubing Cutter, Wrench and good bender is all you really need to do hardline. When making up swaged fittings the swaging is usually the biggest problem with leaking/unreliable hardline. Swagelok style fittings are way quicker and easier to make and considerably more forgiving. You do need to follow proper assembly so you seat the ferrule correctly but after a couple you will do it instinctually.

[Drcemento]

wow wow wow. that mag is sweat. been looking for something cleaner than braided line and that is the ticket!
thanks Doc! now i gotta get more stuff!

[Drcemento]

alright Doc, got a bender and some yor-loks to clean up a mag project. re-visited this thread, and took another look at that mag... what kind of voodoo magic allowed you to run the hard line into the lowers and vertical bottle adapter with no elbows? specially machined pieces? I can't find any off the shelf fitting that would allow that....

[The Inflicted]

Any need to fill the tubing with salt while bending it?

[Grendel]

If you are using a good tubing bender on stainless meant for bending, do not bend tubing tighter bend the recommended (i.e. 2x dia of tube) and know how read the instructions on how to use the tool no. It does not hurt to do so especially when bending tight and multiple bends. I like fine salt but fine sugar works too then just use hot water to flush out. You can use fine sand but it can get stuck inside the tube if you are not careful. If you are bending brass that is not rated for bending you have to use a filler to bend otherwise it will kink almost immediately. I always use salt fill on Brass and Copper tubing. One trick is make your bend toward the middle of the tubing get all of your bends done then trim the tubing to length. It is more wasteful of tubing at first thought but if you are not practiced at bending and you bend base on fit into the fitting on one end and work your way along there is a high likelihood that you will screw up and end up throwing away the whole section of tubing or accept something you do not like. Start in the middle and work your way to the fittings and trim to fit usually is less wasteful.

[DocsMachine]

is that p-block stock the same design as the one you recently made?

-Pretty much. That one right there is the first one I ever made, based directly off the Marksmann P-stocks that Smart Parts, at the time, was importing from the UK. Those were all telescoping, though, and adjustable for length, I simplified mine by making it fixed. That very photo stirred enough interest that I eventually made a few runs of them over the years.

I currently still have some in stock, too, in black anno. If you're interested, you can order one here, or hit me up directly and I can get'cha taken care of.

Any need to fill the tubing with salt while bending it?

-Absolutely not. I've never once needed to. Use a proper tubing bender (something like this) and it's dead easy.

Remember, this stuff is instrumentation tubing- meant to connect pressure gauges to various systems, to connect gas supplies to machines, to sample fluids coming off of processes, etc. There's no way you'd want to risk contamination by having to fill a tube with and or salt or sugar.

Doc.

[Trbo323]

I've seen hardline that can be annoed before, anyone have info on that?

Sent from my motorola edge 5G UW (2021) using Tapatalk

[Grendel]

Aluminum gage tubing, there are specific fittings designed for aluminum gage tubing but you can use Swagelock, Yor-lock with it but you do need to be a little more careful of side loading of the tubing. Most the time in paintball aluminum has been used as an alternative for Macro-Line and Macro-line fittings in particular CCM fittings.

[Drcemento]

Alright Doc, got a bender and some yor-loks to clean up a mag project. re-visited this thread, and took another look at that mag... what kind of voodoo magic allowed you to run the hard line into the lowers and vertical bottle adapter with no elbows? specially machined pieces? I can't find any off the shelf fitting that would allow that....

[Jordan]

Alright Doc, got a bender and some yor-loks to clean up a mag project. re-visited this thread, and took another look at that mag... what kind of voodoo magic allowed you to run the hard line into the lowers and vertical bottle adapter with no elbows? specially machined pieces? I can't find any off the shelf fitting that would allow that....

IIRC, he made a post on the Tinker's Guild years ago on how he did it... drilled out 1/8"npt plugs that were silver soldered onto the lines, then careful assembly in an order that allows everything to connect to the lines and bolt up.

[Drcemento]

Oh man - that's actually approachable for me and my skills.... gonna have to ponder that one. sooooo clean.

[DocsMachine]

IIRC, he made a post on the Tinker's Guild years ago on how he did it... drilled out 1/8"npt plugs that were silver soldered onto the lines, then careful assembly in an order that allows everything to connect to the lines and bolt up.

-Basically this. Drilled out some stainless steel 1/8" pipe plugs (made a fixture to do it in the lathe) and soldered those to the end of the tubing.

The trick is to lightly screw the plug into the part (ASA, expansion chamber, regulator, etc.) and then fit the tubing between the part you're connecting. If 'depth' is important, I've made a mark on the tubing, so I can be sure to solder the bushing in the right spot.

You don't necessarily need true silver solder, though that is, by far, the best. I used a low-silver hard solder, and a strong liquid flux meant for silver soldering.

Sand/scuff the ends of the tubing, and of course the drilled bore of the plug ends up lightly roughened. Don't overheat anything- if the tubing turns blight brown or blue, the solder will not stick to it. Let it cool, resand to clean metal, try again. They're small enough parts, and with a low-silver solder (about 465 F melting point) you shouldn't have to heat it that much.

Be ready to drop more flux on while it's hot- you don't always have to, but I've found that helps if the solder is reluctant to "wet".

The big trick to it all is assembly. On that 'Mag, for example, the upper line does not flex, so I had to remove the pin from the valve- so it could be drawn straight out, rather than turned slightly.

And to assemble it all, you have to install the upper line to the vertical adapter, then slide in the valve.

For the lower line, as I recall, I had to install the line to the expansion chamber- loose- then the ASA to the line. Then screw the chamber to the VASA, and tighten the line the last little bit by rising the duckbill to the stock.

And that's why you don't see too many of them out there- players really liked the look, but it's a headache to service and maintain. Macroline can be snapped apart like a quick-disconnect, this stuff meant you had to disassemble half the gun.

Doc.