How to Glue Delrin Sleeve to Stainless

[shooter311]

After hanging out with forest_ptp for a bit he showed me a prototype Automag bolt that was started and never completed. The idea was a bolt that could accept different "sleeves", he had two types of sleeves, a delrin and a polished aluminum. Also this would be the first (and I assume only) delrin automag bolt). He said they had them made, but after the sleeves were press fit onto the bolt they had a tendency to fly off on the field. Unfortunately, the project was prematurely dropped to move on to more important things. He press fit one Delrin sleeve onto a bolt for me and I put it in my minimag pump. After about 100 shots the sleeve moved forward on the bolt about a centimeter blocking the feed port. it popped back on easily enough.

Is there anyway anyone knows of to glue delrin onto stainless? Any suggestions on retaining this sleeve on the bolt?

Thanks!

[BrickHaus]

I had one of those old sleeved bolts on a mag I bought years back. As for gluing, there is so many products on the market today for such an application, Im sure someone will chime in with a suggestion.

[Toestr]

Interesting that they didn't have it thread on, or at least be affixed with a screw from the front or back.

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[scottieb]

I was thinking a set screw, or two. There are a lot of STBB bolts with the front delrin portion affixed to the rear metal portion this way.

[forest_ptp]

On the right track. Biggest issue was that the sleeve has to perfectly align with the bolt, but that was one 20/20 hindsight thought. As to the other - maybe the best option, but I was always super paranoid about any screw-like exiting the barrel after a possible "Rapid Unscheduled Disassembly"...

[Tracker]

i would make sure you avoid anything that likes to expand as it cures. regardless if its capable for the job or not

[Mishotaki]

I also think that a setscrew would be be better than glue, as it won't be affected by weather/humidity and outside forces as much... I would use a headless one, locktighted in the bolt so that it doesn't induce drag if it unscrews towards the outside.

[shooter311]

That is a really good idea. I wonder how it would shoot if I cut the head off and maybe put a foamie on the bolt. That should reduce the pressure of the air pushing the delrin sleeve off.

[uv_halo]

I think it must be possible to bond delrin to steel, possibly through heating and cooling the parts? I actually have / had (I'll try to check tonight) a prototype AGD Delrin 'automag' bolt. Quotes are because it's actually longer than a standard automag bolt to discourage theft at events where it was shown. It was given to me when I was getting my FN303 up to speed as it too, uses a longer bolt than an automag.

[uv_halo]

I snapped a pic. It is very similar to the one from PTP. A delrin sleeve over a steel core.

[Toestr]

What about putting a screw in the back through the sealing cylinder thing and up into the sleeve/tip. The screw would obviously need to be locked/sealed in. I don't think it would be able to fit through the bolt if it did become dislodged.

Also what is the point behind having a delrin sleeve anyway? Less wear to the breach? It seems like the delrin would get chewed up by the spring.

[uv_halo]

If I remember correctly, it was relayed to me, the idea was that a delrin bolt would be lighter and cycle faster. It didn't work for Tom Kaye in the end (I don't remember the why).

[Cunha]

They wore out in the mag. first they were Delrin which wore too fast. Then they were nylon which was better. There’s no way to tell the two apart for a layman except that one is gunna be usable and the other wearing out fast.

then they made the superbolt 2 aka the level 10 and the Delrin superbolt 1 project was obsoleted. Superbolt 2 used thin stainless to lighten the weight and handle the wear better.

[Revs9k]

Another option is to drill them and Pin them like a delrin tip on the shocktech bolts. using a roll pin would be quick and easy

[Brokeass_baller]

If you can drill that stainless on center, and make sure the pin doesn't interfere with the power tube.

[Shane-O]

Alot of suggestions for setscrew or a pin, but that will not work. The middle of the bolt has a post to open and close the dump chamber, and anything protruding into the center of the bolt will cause issues. Also, the LVL10 bolt is the same weight or actually lighter than the Delrin one. The weight of the bolt isnt a real issue, as we have seen mags cycle at 20+ Bps with the standard RT bolt and Level10 bolt. Its trying to fix something that isnt a problem.

[Grendel]

Maybe a solution looking for a problem????? Seems like a lot of complication for nebulous gain?

[shooter311]

I assume these were made before the lvl 10, and the bolt seems significantly lighter than a lvl 7 bolt. So, it was probably a great idea if it worked back then. This is going in a pump, so lvl 10 is not ideal, and I don't know why, but for some reason this bolt pumps so much better than the lvl 7. So If I could just slap some elmers on there and fix the problem, I would be happy! lol

[Grendel]

If you are going to use it on a pump then abrade the surfaces and use a non-expanding epoxy like Loctite EA 9153. It will not be seeing the forces long term that you would get being rapidly fired in a semi. Everything I can find on the subject does not recommend adhesives for Delrin (this includes Loctite literature) but instead design in a mechanical attachment. Most of the advise is to use a high shear 2 part epoxy if you can not use some form of mechanical attachment. I would routinely inspect the bolt after use to see if it is having issues staying in place.

[Brokeass_baller]

Or just polish a Lvl 7. Stainless has a very low friction coefficient.

[Shane-O]

Biggest problem is safety. Launching a delrin or aluminum sleeve out the barrel is an horrible consequence of trying to fix something that doesnt need fixed. If your pump stroke is heavier look for other ways to help with that, or start working out........

[shooter311]

It is one of those 3d printed pump kits, so I just chalked the faulty cocking up to lack of precision. However, I threw that PTP bolt in for testing and it was perfect. I might try to track down other types of bolts and see if there is another tried and true bolt that works as well.

[Shane-O]

You are missing the point. The LVL 7 bolt IS the tried and true part. There is something else causing your issue. Just because you threw a different bolt in and it worked better, does not mean that is what is wrong. The rear lip of the bolt of the LVL7 may be slightly thicker causing more force to required against the wave spring for it to rest. Could be your sear, or the pump rod doesnt actuate with the LVL7 bolt like it should, and on and on.

[shooter311]

I'm not missing the point. I have tried adjusting just about everything there is to adjust within reason. I even had what many would call a mag expert work on it. My specific pump kit just doesn't play well with the LVL 7 bolt. It is way less of a headache to dig through my stuff and throw an ANS bolt in there if it works perfectly with my pump kit. I don't see a large benefit of a Lvl 7 bolt on a mag pump over an ANS or similar.

[Siress]

I don't condone this project at all for the safety risk it poses to the other players. That said, "retaining compound" is what you need - though you'll need to do some digging to find one that won't embrittle the delrin.