Help a noob ID some parts and get started

[GingerBreadPaint]

Ever since my buddy started looking at Autocockers and pumps I started looking at retro markers as well and fell in love with the Automags pretty quickly. Finally after much looking and staring I bought my first mag at IoN about two weeks ago.

I have done some mixed research and admittedly only feel like I know enough to be a danger to myself, and my wallet. I was hoping some of you could help me identify what exactly I have and where to go from here, what changes may or may not be compatible, etc.

https://imgur.com/a/id5OkXN

I know (at least 90% sure) I have a warp feed body (not sure if is called a left or right) and a level 10 bolt with X valve. Other than that I have very little idea what is what and if things are in order. Outside of what is shown in the link above I have not disassembled the valve or power tube to check inside. I have little to no idea what some of the small parts are used for.

My three large outstanding questions are:
1. What are the extra springs for? what does each color mean and what are they best for?
2. What are the grooved brass spacers for? I recall they go in the power tube, but which ones are best for what?
3. The fore grip is hollow and has a threaded hole for a fitting and I've seen pictures of setups using that to route air. How do I do that? It is an option I want to keep open when I rework the fittings and asa.

Changes I know I want to make, that I can think of any way:
- ULE vertical feed body
- replace lines, fittings and asa
- maybe replace grips for better ambidextrous shooting
- if not already inside, probably the ULE trigger. Much later

Thanks in advance everyone

[Olsson]

1. The gold, red, and silver springs came with the Xvalve (or lvl-10 bolt), since you can tune the lvl-10 bolt with them. More specifically, you tune how much opposing force the bolt will have, when you pull the trigger. In short, the longer the spring, the softer the bolt goes forward, and the gentler it is on paint. This also affects how easy the bolt will stop its forward motion if it hits a ball half way down the breech.

The silver spring was not intended to use at full length, but to be cut down to a desired length for each individual gun/user. If cut, it is important to put the cut end toward the bolt, as to not chew up the body with the cut end, for each shot being fired. Nowadays, the silver spring is discontinued by AGD, which makes sense, since people almost exclusively used the red spring anyway.

2. Those spacers - carriers as they are called - are used to set up the lvl-10 bolt, and to a certain degree fine tune it. In order for the bolt to work properly with its anti chop function, the spacers needs to be just tight enough to not leak, but not so tight as to have the bolt stick when it aborts its forward motion, hitting a ball half way down. All the carriers have differing inner diameter, marked by the dots and rings on the outside. By the way, the very thin shim you've got there is either to fine tune the lvl-10 bolt, as to when it resets, or to fine tune a ULT-trigger. They differ some 0.005" in thickness, and are interchangeable (providing you want the thicker thickness).

3. You cannot use your fore grip for that specific option. There is no lower inlet hole for air - or upper for that matter, on your foregrip. That foregrip is probably a Benchmark, although there were several brands looking like that.. Someone will probably correct me, if I picked the wrong one. There was originally a barrel plug going in the bottom of the foregrip, as a convenient way of storing it during the matches.

As for routing the air from the ASA to the foregrip, and from the foregrip (or from rather what is called the vertical ASA), you would need a foregrip that is designed as a gas through/expansion chamber, and an Automag vertical ASA. You will find a gazillion pictures of it, to find different versions on google, or half a gazillion pictures here on MCB. Personally I like the set up, since it gets the air hoses out of the way, but it is very much a personal preference.


The valve is an X-valve, as you stated, although it is more of a custom to call it an X-valve with a lvl-10 bolt, rather than the other way around. The bolt with the stem is the lvl-10 bolt, correct, and it is the bolt that has the anti chop technology. The power tube end (or rather power tube tip) looks different from the others you have seen, since it is the tip for the lvl-10 bolt. The tip for the lvl-7 and the lvlt-10 are not interchangeable, and neither are the innards of the power tube. You can of course use your X-valve with a lvl-7 bolt. you just have to switch out the power tube innards and the tip. The bolt without the stem is a lvl-7 bolt, correct. The blue damper came with classic valves with lvl-7 bolts, the clear one came with later valves with lvl-10 bolt. The clear one absorbs shock better, the blue one lasts forever.


Furthermore, the body is most probably not a warp feed body.It is a Minimag body, rather than an Automag body, and I do not think that the feedneck is tailored for warp feed. There were power feed bodies specifically made for warp feed, and the easiest way of noticing is to have a standard one next to it, to notice the differing power feed. More specifically, there must be enough feed neck sticking out downwards, in order to be able to mount an elbow facing down. Your body doesn't look to have that. Oh, and it is a "power feed left-body", or to make it even more clear, a "power feed left, hopper right-body".

The rail is a Benchmark rail. The logo has faded, from the oval recess in the back of the rail. I am unsure of it's value, but my guess is that it is marginally more valuable than any other blue rail, other than for someone searching for a specific build.

You don't really need to switch out the wood grips to be able to shoot ambidextrously. They work just fine shooing from the left shoulder. Should you want to sell them, people here will snap them up in an instant. Don't let them go for anything lower than $50 - unless you sell them to me, in which case I will argue that they are worthless... Jokes aside, they look to be in mint condition, and with a beautiful color. $50-60 depending on how quickly you want them to go, I'd guess. Also, the frame is an early frame, since it is in pot metal, rather than the composite carbon frames that has been standard since ages ago. The pot metal one is just as good, by the way.


As for fine tuning the lvl-10, some people really don't like the hassle while others swear by the lvl-10. Personally I think it is one of the best inventions ever made for paintball, and I have a valve with lvl-10 that has 100-150K balls through it (since I bought it), with not a single ball chopped so far. I have shot all kinds of paint, including ultra brittle paint for competitions, and over a 12 year period, the only maintenance has been a generous amount of oil each year.


If you need help on either ID, och tech questions, I am sure there will be several Automag enthusiasts and tech savvy members here on MCB. Oh, and by the way, the slight corrosion on the sear, it will polish right out.

[GingerBreadPaint]

First and foremost, thank you for the amazingly detailed write-up. Sorry for a delay in response, took a day to process and return with questions.

My final intended setup at the end of this project marker is a mostly bullet proof (ie. set it and forget it), I'm not fond of spending time tinkering and tuning my marker every time I go play.

With that in mind I have a few follow ups to what you said:
1. Should I go ahead and swap to the red spring? Or is that something I should just experiment with to find my shot feel?

2. I see the dots that you mentioned, seems the 2 that I thought were duplicates in fact were the dot versions. I did not get any relevant paperwork like a manual (though it did come with the mini CD for the lvl-10 install, does not look in great shape, have not tried to run it). I assume I can go find a manual online for the spacers and shims.

3.Ok cool. Might still keep it if the rail stays.


For the valve and bolt. Since I don't have the parts for the power tube to swap over for lvl-7, I don't see a point in keeping that I guess. I would rather have an anti-chop setup any way. The Clear Damper, while still intact, feels very gummy and very flat towards the middle like it has been compressed for a long time. Is that worth replacing or ok to keep for now?

Looking up Minimag bodies, I think you are correct.

Found an older listing here on MCB for the same rail in black for $80. It was listed as a Benchmark rail. If it is compatible with a ULE body I would like to keep the rail.

Only reason I might swap the grips (but would keep them any way) is that I have small hands. It is a nice snug fit in my right hand but I have to choke up a bit to reach the trigger with my left. Do slide frames exist? Only two thing that might draw me away from the current frame is a nice Y frame or a decent slide trigger frame. I had doubts about it being metal frame, it did not feel like metal, but the paint was peeling and made a scratch. Sure enough you are right again, it's metal frame.

Stated earlier, but if only want to swap the Mini for a ULE body will that work?
Other than that it seems like I just need to rework the asa and hose line.

Thanks again for the super detailed write-up.

*edit - this video was very helpful explaining how to use the spacers and shims. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0mvr30jKhw

[Olsson]

No worries mate - it's not like I needed to get your answer ASAP. It's a hobby - so I try to keep it relaxed. The key word here being "try"...

Being bullet proof is one of the major attraction points for Automag players. Once it has been set up properly, a hefty dose of oil every year or two is usually the only thing that is needed to keep it running for a decade. O-rings tend to last forever on an Automag, and I am of the opinion that you should never switch o-rings on an Automag, unless the old ones have started leaking. There are of course differing opinions, but I know for a fact that there is quite a bunch of Automag players that share my view.

If your X-valve can handle the red spring at 300 FPS without venting, I would say that the red spring is your best bet. If it vents, the fast and easy fix is to use the gold spring, although you probably would like to service the valve in the future, in order to use the red spring. There are Automag players who prefer the gold spring, but I would hazard to guess that most prefer the red one - and it is gentler on paint, that's a given. Note that both the level-10 bolt as such, and the red spring as well, use more air. Not that is is a problem nowadays when HPA is common everywhere.

Yes, you will easily find manuals for level-10 bolts, as well as written guides, guides on Youtube, etc, etc, etc. As I mentioned in my previous post, you will be able to get help and advice with everything and anything Automag related here on MCB. Another wellspring of info is automags.org. There are specific members here and on AO (automags.org) who are being held in high regard. Superman - (his nickname) is considered to be the current Automag-whisperer. There are also Luke, from Luke's Customs, and Tunaman who have incredible Automag knowledge, and who all service, tech, and provide custom parts and builds.

The rail will work just fine with a ULE body. You just have to remove the twistlock pin, which keeps the twistlock barrel in place. The twistlock pin is press fit, so it should be possible to remove by pressing. Occasionally they are quite stuck, but firm pressing will remove it.

Wash the clear damper with some mild hand soap. The gumminess in general is nothing to worry about, since it is more gummy than the blue damper even when it is brand new. However, if it is sticky and gooey, and tends to stick on the bolt, then it is time to switch it for a new one. If it doesn't stick to the bolt, then it is perfectly fine.

As far as I know, there has never been a slider frame made for the Automag. A lot of Autococker frames fit on the Automag, but obviously you cannot use any of the guts, but have to strip them clean. There has been a frame - the Medusa - that was made to work with both the Autococker and the Automag. In fact, that was the main selling point of it way back in the day, when the Mag and the Cocker were the two top dogs. Still, that was a swing frame as well.

Well, there is no real need to keep the lvl-7 bolt, if you're going to use your lvl-10. However, if you also switch out the body, you will then have a spare body and bolt - and probably a spare barrel as well. You see - this is how Automags breed in the wild. Most Automag players started out with just the one Automag, and then - somehow in the dark depths of the spare box, it started to multiply...

[GingerBreadPaint]

Thanks. I think that answers is all my questions for now. Once I am closer to a working mag I will probably sell off the spare bits, have enough markers floating around between magfed and not.

[Number six]

Olsson has pretty much everything spot-on.
That Benchmark rail is a very cool piece.
The Minimag body is a longer version of the standard Automag body, coupled with that pictured aluminum barrel for the sake of making it look like a minigun. That lasering on the side is interesting, but I don't know anything about it.
The foregrip is either Benchmark or Viewloader, but as far as I know, the Smart Parts "Gadget Grip" was the only one to have a stowable barrel plug.
The X-valve is an expensive piece, of course, and drops about three pounds off of a Mag versus a Classic valve (stainless vs aluminum). They really like a high input pressure, so don't try to use a tank with an output of less than 850psi. Also, don't try to use Co2 with that valve. Or a regulator foregrip.
They like oil. Two or three drops at the start of the day, and two more at the middle of the day will keep her happy.
Personally, I think the wood grips are very comfy, but I have large hands. They're also valuable, as stated.
The Level 10 bolt, as stated, does not chop.
Once it's running, you'll probably enjoy it. They're beautifully simple, reliable, and purpose-built. Eerily similar to an A-10 Warthog, in that respect.

[GingerBreadPaint]

Thanks, yeah I've got small hands. The wood grip fits just right in my right hand, but the way it's cut is just a bit large for my left hand. It's a grip from a time when people did not know how to shoot off hand, I think I can make it work.