98C response trigger installed, burps & won't cycle.

[SuperActionMan]

I have an older 98 Custom that I just outfitted with a response trigger. It is the first Tippmann I have ever owned or had opened-up. I cleaned, polished, and lubed everything while it was apart. It has the old power tube with no provision for an RT or Cyclone banjo screw; I drilled and tapped that post on the PT and milled just a hair off the face at the same time so the threads and banjo sealing surface are perpendicular. There are no leaks. Tank is an HK 48/3000. Marker worked normally before the RT install.

When I got it back together, it would just burp like the tank was low, which it wasn't. I had to turn the velocity screw out several turns to get it to cycle properly.

Is that normal/common or is something not right?

[Finny45]

Hey there, I got a lot of Tippmann's, both A5s, 98s, but I'm no expert...My experience with RTs are on A5s, however I have had to adjust both velocity screw and then the RTs screw after to get it dialed in properly. The RT is just another piston that takes air away from the rest of the system. Have you had a chance to chrono it at all since install?

The other thing I would recommend trying to run an RT or cyclone feed on HPA is the Fat Hose kits. The fittings are 1/8 instead of whatever the stock size is, and the hose gets larger as well. I seem to have had luck swapping hoses and fitting sizes on A5s that refused to cycle the cyclone or got air starved when running on HPA and an RT.

So yea, pretty common from what I have seen.

[Myrkul]

Something is definitely wrong. I've built and tuned a bunch of R/T 98s and they never have an issue recocking. They might need some velocity adjustment, and the R/T system itself always needs to be tuned, but they always recock if installed correctly. Call Tippmann for a new power tube. They have sent me a new one for free multiple times. My guess is that when you drilled and milled your current tube something is off and gas is escaping, which means you don't get enough recock air. I would also strongly recommend the larger gas lines if running the R/T on HPA. Once you have the new power tube installed, disassemble the banjo that connects to the power tube. Note the orientation of the hole in the banjo screw in relation to the the screw head, and be sure it is lined up correctly for maximum airflow into the RT system when reassembled. Finally, throw a dab of blue loctite on the threads of the banjo during reassembly to ensure it seals correctly.

If it is still having recock issues, you might have niched an "o" ring during the disassembly process, or put something back together incorrectly.

An incorrectly installed R/T system won't have an audible leak, since it is only under pressure for a fraction of a second while the marker is firing.

Don't be surprised if you only get kind of "meh" results out of a Tippmann R/T initially. For maximum performance they really like high output pressure tanks (850 psi +). I typically run mine at 950 PSI, but like automag R/Ts the higher your tank pressure the better they do. They also benefit from stronger main springs, weaker valve springs, and a good bore match.

[Toestr]

The RT kit comes with a heavier sear spring, make sure you have that installed.

[Trbo323]

1) did you oil it when you put it all back together?

2) you mentioned polishing, describe what you did

3) shove a barrel swab down the barrel, will it recock with that in the barrel?

4) did you happen to install a flatline when putting it back together?

I doubt the problem is in the RT itself, the one thing I could see is something happened when you drilled the tube. If there's too much air leaving the system it can have issues recocking.

Turning the velocity screw out and it working better is odd. Typically it's the other way around. If the velocity screw is too far out it allows too much air to leave the system and doesn't have enough back pressure to recock. I've had a few times where turning it in was needed to make the marker recock

Have you chronoed it yet?

Sent from my motorola edge 5G UW (2021) using Tapatalk

[SuperActionMan]

I did make sure to install the heavier sear spring from the kit. Also plan on converting to the larger 1/8" lines in the near future. I'll look at how the banjo bolt holes align with the tube outlet in the mean time. I have a bunch of Clippard elbows like that and can do parts matching if necessary.

1) did you oil it when you put it all back together?

2) you mentioned polishing, describe what you did

3) shove a barrel swab down the barrel, will it recock with that in the barrel?

4) did you happen to install a flatline when putting it back together?

I doubt the problem is in the RT itself, the one thing I could see is something happened when you drilled the tube. If there's too much air leaving the system it can have issues recocking.

Turning the velocity screw out and it working better is odd. Typically it's the other way around. If the velocity screw is too far out it allows too much air to leave the system and doesn't have enough back pressure to recock. I've had a few times where turning it in was needed to make the marker recock

5) Have you chronoed it yet?

1.) Yes.

2.) Just enough 600 grit wet sanding to take the overspray off where the bolt and hammer slide, then polished with 2000.

3.) I did not try that. Increasing velocity got it to cock and the RT working and that's where I stopped messing with things. It technically works now, just didn't seem right having to wind the velocity screw out so much.

4.) Not a Flatline, but an Apex.

5.) Not yet.

[BrickHaus]

Let's see your valve itself. If I recall, og rt kits had a valve upgrade that had more air passage slots cut into it? Maybe that was just the a5.. I recall swapping valves on just about every old tippmann I had.

2nd. Try to boil a few variables out. id first make sure the rt system is air tight.

If you close the rt flow meter completely. ( turn it clockwise til it stops), the fire a shot. The rt piston should lock up if it's getting air. If the trigger bleeds pressure, you got leaks in the rt system back to the shooter. If the trigger never jumps, the system may not be getting the burst of air, so back to valve.

I'm wondering is the air slots in your valve miss your air transfer tube. In which case, I'd just mod the valve to match.

[SuperActionMan]

Yes, the trigger locks up with the flow control fully closed.

I'm going to tear it back down anyway it seems, so I'll pull the valve all the way out this time too. When I drilled the PT, I felt down the passage with a pick and the hole definitely went into an open space that I didn't make with the drill. I figured that was a transfer slot. I drilled it with a #22/0.157" so the 10-32 threads would be marginally tighter, but I don't know that it was enough to mater. I didn't want to make them so tight that installing the banjo would split the plastic.

[Chappy]

Chrono the gun before you do anything else.
Also, Did you put a new oring on the hammer? The old one is worn into the pre polished body, so more recock gas is getting past. Might be negligible but thought it was worth mentioning

[lhamilton1807]

Here is a video showing how to tune a RT on a Project Salvo, essentially a T98C in BDUs. At about 3:36 it talks about tuning it.

[SuperActionMan]

Chrono the gun before you do anything else.
Also, Did you put a new oring on the hammer? The old one is worn into the pre polished body, so more recock gas is getting past. Might be negligible but thought it was worth mentioning

No seals were replaced. It doesn't look like the hammer o-ring rides on anything but the inside of the power tube. 🤷♂️