A question about modern field etiquette

[Euphie]

So long ago when I played on a team one of our rules were that you can’t whine. Primarily this took the form of you can’t yell about “I shot that guy right in the hopper!” Or argue with refs.

it was part of the normal field culture we had though, if people did that stuff you made fun of them and called them posers I mean who do they think they are Aftershock? There was an expectation that on the Recball field for practice we had to not act like we were aggrieved pros.

Something I noticed though last time I was out and confirmed from watching some gorpro footage is that this sort of thing seems to not only happen locally in recball but, no one seems to make fun of them for it. I don’t get this at all, not only should you not be acting like Dynasty if you think you shot a renter they are almost always wrong.

I mean just watch so GoPro footage you will see paint land several feet to the side of someone and the video creator yell about someone playing on. I mean in the heat of the moment it is very easy to think you hit someone when you haven’t so why are so many people being so loud about it?

I don’t like it at tournaments either but I at least get it there, even though if I were to ever be on a team again sportsmanship and professionalism would be more important to me than maybe convincing a ref of something. In recball though I don’t understand it at all like is this a local thing or is this just what people do now?

[BrickHaus]

Theres a similar thread in the members forum, so Id say its a more common issue in other areas.

Folk around my parts will ask the opposing player to check their hoppers or pod packs on hit zones they may not notice. And or banter eachother with "how bout that one?"

But I guess its a double edged sword. The otherwise alternative is keep shooting the hand goes up, but with rentals, they may hesitate and or be stunned by a hit so theres a major delay in hit calling. Then you are the asshole bonus balling people. So expierenced players may or may not clearly see a break, but commonly yell to rentals to call hits if they are hit before sending another volley of shots. Maybe this is the intent? But it may be different locally for you.

That plus they commonly believe gun hits dont count even after being briefed otherwise. This happened last weekend to the point the refs had to re brief everyone mid day and again at the end because they were working OT to pull shot up rentals who were playing on.

It likely comes down to area, qnd previous expierence with renters.

[the_matrix_guy]

I don't know. Ever since I can remember, (mid 90's) recballers were calling out hits and refs. I think it's 100% normal. It's no different than playing other sports - it's no different than playing street b-ball or hockey with your friends, for instance, and all of the sudden the game feels like it's life and death -- and everyone is playing for an NBA or NHL championship. Everyone's calling fouls and calling out teammates for not playing defense, etc. It's part of the game. Paintball has always been a hyper competitive environment. Same with video games. People take video games wayyy too seriously in casual settings and are super toxic over the mics.

But consider that 1) there are lots of cheaters which should be called out, and 2) there is a tendency for speedball players to emulate pros, in that they keep playing after they're hit even though they know they're hit because that is what they're trained to do until a ref notices and pulls them out. The problem with that in a walk-on/recball setting is that you don't have professional refs or the same amount of refs period, so then you gotta call people out. But there's never been such etiquette in paintball. Ever. Walk-ons were always hyper competitive even in recball/casual settings. And I wouldn't even consider that as part of PB etiquette to begin with. Maybe in a party/rental setting where people are playing for the first time, etc, and getting a feel for the game, and no one is trying to be the next Greenspan, etc.

[Olsson]

Field etiquette will always be vastly surpassed by the culture of any specific field. At a field with toxic culture, calling out hits will be as you describe - yet another way of being an asshole, yelling, cursing and calling out non existing hits. At a field with a friendly culture, calling out hits is simply a way of helping people noticing hits they weren't aware of - and at a friendly field, they will be thankful for it, since you're helping them to avoid playing on, while actually being out, albeit unknowingly.

For pretty much every aspect of paintball, it all boils down to the culture of the specific field.
Somebody looks for you after the match, to find out if you shot him? Toxic field - he will yell at you that he was already out, you moron - even though he didn't mark himself as out. Friendly field - the guy commends you for the great shot.
Somebody had to shoot an entire hopper at you before nailing you. Toxic field - he will yell at you during the match, and call you a cheater afterwards. Friendly field - he will politely ask if he at least hit some of the balls, to know if they bounced, to know whether his aim was off, or the paint let him down.
Somebody from your own team shot you when you were up front. Toxic field - he will berate you, since it was your fault somehow... Friendly field - the guy will apologize, and it will be obvious that he is incredibly ashamed.
Your marker gives up, and you cannot tech it yourself. Toxic field - people will laugh and point at you. Friendly field - you will immediately get a high end setup thrust into your hands, while somebody techs your marker.
A beginner gets shot while making an obvious mistake. Toxic field - the guy who nailed the beginner gets high five by his friends, while sniggering to themselves. Friendly field - the guy who shot the beginner finds him after the match to explain how he got shot, and how to avoid the obvious mistake in the future.

The list goes on - and it is always the culture of the field that matters.

[MrBarraclough]

Precisely. Field-specific culture is huge. Good fields foster and reinforce a friendly, sportsmanlike culture. Poor fields don't bother to cultivate a positive culture and allow a negative one to flourish. And field cultures are positive feedback loops; they are self-reinforcing. Once you let a field's culture turn bad, it becomes ever more difficult to change.

[drewkroeker]

I play at Splatters Paintball in Manitoba, Canada. Reading through your list makes me realize what an awesome field I play at. Everybody is there to have a chill Sunday afternoon, nobody is playing with an attitude like it's the NXL finals even if they are carrying the latest and greatest tournament marker.

[RAZRBAKK]

Generally if it's a renter and they don't call it I will let it slide, but if I clearly tag a gun owner and they don't call out, pretty quick I'll be on them.

[wunderbarsafari]

I support politely calling on players or refs to check hits that may be unobvious or ignored. It is often hard to tell if you bounced, broke, or just splattered paint on someone. But I draw a distinction between that and players yelling "GTFO! and Onhishopper! Onhishopper! Onhishopper!" in rec play.

I'm not sure its just a kids these days kind of thing though. When I started playing in CA in the late 90s-early 00s there were always wannabes at the field squawking at people with no clue whether or not they actually eliminated someone.

[Tarsun2]

ive never called out someone for a hit. im a believer in keep shooting until the hand comes up. (within reason).

[Euphie]

I support politely calling on players or refs to check hits that may be unobvious or ignored. It is often hard to tell if you bounced, broke, or just splattered paint on someone. But I draw a distinction between that and players yelling "GTFO! and Onhishopper! Onhishopper! Onhishopper!" in rec play.

I'm not sure its just a kids these days kind of thing though. When I started playing in CA in the late 90s-early 00s there were always wannabes at the field squawking at people with no clue whether or not they actually eliminated someone.

Oh, I am all for trying to inform someone, it is the weird yelling and screaming thing that makes it very WTF for me. Especially when it isn't usually clear that they in fact hit anything at all. I for one know many times that I think I hit someone that I in fact didn't or it was a bounce, the only way to really know is if you see it obviously break on them. If I think I might have hit someone, I just keep shooting at them until they yell out, put their gun up, or react in some way that makes it obvious I did in fact hit them, most renters will jerk back a bit if you hit them so I tend to back off till I know if I hit them or they are just scared of paint landing near them. Nothing wrong with asking for a paintcheck, just don't lose control and start screaming is all. Just a bit of a culture shock for me seeing that off of the speedball field.

[Dusty Bottoms]

I've never had a problem calling hits out in a friendly way playing recball, especially to renters. I really don't like shooting people more than I have to, and I'd much prefer to nail your hopper than your forehead. Renters are often completely oblivious or reckless, or both, and often don't know you've painted their hopper until you point it out. Yelling or screaming is just silly though in a recball game. It's the same reason I don't dive into bunkers and abuse my equipment, there's no money on the line at all. I think some tourney guys don't totally lower their intensity level on the field to recball levels if their mixed in a group, but I've never heard anything too bad at mine.

[Chappy]

Paintball field etiquette is not and has never been consistent from field to field let alone from region to region.

[Grendel]

Yup, you can only control your behavior and make a "good" example for others. Good behavior breeds good behavior but takes patience and consistency. All I ask from people is to play the game fairly, by the rules and don't be a "dick". If a field allows bad behavior without consequence I just go someplace else. It is not my job or responsibility to police players actions/behaviors; that is the fields. All I can do is abide by the rules of the game at the field I am playing and not be a dick. If there are players that behave in a manor not to my liking I just do not play with them or "freeze them out". They either get the hint or the field addresses the issue; otherwise I play my game and move on with life.

[Tarsun2]

we would also agree, up front, at the beginning, of the "rules", and that the reffs decision, whatever it is, is the final say.

[Grendel]

I honestly wish field rules were more consistent. I have played all over the country and each set of locals feels their local rules are the rules everywhere and that is so far from the truth. The tournament leagues don't even agree on the rules for tournaments and there are even venue variants within the same league [at least in the past when I actually cared about tournament rules].

When you travel for play you have to relearn - 1) gun hits/no gun hits 2) all body hits/certain body parts excluded 3) Chrono <= 275/280/285/300 fps 4) surrender rules/no surrender rules or mandatory/non-mandatory surrender 5) bunker tag/no bunker tag 6) Hit and Break/ Hit only 7).....etc

[MrBarraclough]

I think a decent rule of thumb is to call out hits when you can tell the other player exactly where to check. I've certainly received the occasional stealth hit on the side of a boot heel or pod pack that I never felt. If someone is telling me to check a specific place, I'm happy to check and not suspicious that they're simply trying to distract me or anything like that.

The occasional "Check it!" when you're pretty sure but not completely sure you've hit someone is okay, but if it's happening more than a couple of times a day you're likely being overly optimistic about your own shooting.

I try to make a habit of calling out bounces to my opponents if they're within earshot so they know I have checked and am not ignoring hits. Often I do the same with splatter, especially if I'm really getting showered, so that when I eventually emerge from my bunker smeared with paint they don't think I'm playing on or wiping. On a woodsball field with wooden bunkers, there's always cracks and gaps that liquid paint will spray through.

My local field attacts a lot of renters and doesn't count gun hits. This helps tone things down a bit because it eliminates people getting pissed at oblivious renters with hoppers covered in paint. The downside is that you really have to emphasize the rule against blind firing and enforce it diligently, but that does not seem to be a problem there. The story behind that rule is kind of interesting. The owner is a combat veteran (Army) and his rifle was struck by a bullet that would have otherwise hit him. He credits it with saving his life, so in honor of the rifle that saved him he doesn't count gun hits at his field.

[glaman5266]

I try to be as nice as I can, especially with renters. I just say "Check your (insert thing here)!" Usually works out.

But you do get those people who own their own gear & know what they're doing... And I have no problem with sending a few extra shots at a person who owns their own gear & knows they're hit. Had this happen last year at a big game. Hit a (gear-owning) player in the marker/hands, kept playing, I hit the guy in the hopper, he kept playing, hit him at least two more times before he scampered off likely to find another tree to hide behind. And he wasn't trying to simply leave the area/not get hit. He moved with a damn purpose. I don't feel sorry for those people in the least & they have it coming to them, as far as I'm concerned.

Of course, I give them a chance to check themselves. It's the right thing to do. And these incidents are very uncommon at the places I play. But if it's pretty obvious they're playing on, all bets are off.