Begun, the barrel wars have...

[zinger565]

Mod can delete if this isn't allowed...

Recently there has been some "lively" discussion on the /r/paintball subreddit over barrels, specifically bore matching and accuracy. Definitely some good popcorn content.

Me? I'm in the camp of: Barrel needs to be near ball size for closed bolt markers, other than that I prefer to slightly overbore. Rifling doesn't matter, and with modern porting and finishing, there's not an appreciable difference barrel to barrel.

[SignOfZeta]

I’m confused. What wouldn’t be allowed? What you wrote has already been written here so many times it’s pointless to write it again. I don’t get it why anyone would complain…unless it’s a *really* stupid Reddit fight that you’re trying to move here, which I assume is not the case.

[zinger565]

Not trying to move anything here, just providing some popcorn material for folks and to remind us that the "younger generation" has the same arguments we've all had.

[iamthelazerviking]

Where is that old "beating a dead horse" emoji V Bulletin had? LOL, it's a fun discussion though and there was a recent thread about this a well.

I really like Simon of Inception's approach. He looked at the "ballistics" of shooting 100's of thousands of paintballs and then designed the Stella barrel around his findings. The first 6-8 inches are the most important, and the different bore sized tips offered by Inception is really cool since most other tips are a massive size. Just helps with expansion of gas after acceleration. But in the end, barrels are barrels, paint quality is what matters most.

I have been gravitating towards the overbore route. If there is a chance of rollouts, something to stop them + a bigger bore will lead to less fuss.

[Jordan]

Some of the most accurate markers I've used have been made by PPS, and they have .690 bores with wedgits to prevent rollout.

[DocsMachine]

"Begun"? The barrel/bore argument has been around since WARPIG's "Tech Talk"- and for those who never head the pleasure, that's pushing thirty years ago.

Keep in mind that Freak barrels hit the shelves in, what, 2001? The whole design idea of the Freak, of course, being to match the bore to your paint- and that was over twenty years ago.

No, what happens is certain things come and go in cycles. One of the big ones I've seen over the years is rifled barrels- when the Hammerheads came out (what, twelve, fifteen years ago, now?) everybody thought "it's about time somebody tried rifling", not knowing about things like the Mike Rock rifled barrels in '94.

What happened here is somebody "discovered" that barrels come in different sizes, and that certain paints shoot better in one, than another. That is, of course, an Amazing New Discovery™, so he has to jump on social media to show the world how brilliant he is for bringing such unprecendented new technology to this stodgy old sport.

Can you tell I've dealt with this type before?

Hell, I did a comic about it eighteen years ago:



(Which also fits well in the "flashbang" thread, now that I think about it. )

Doc.

[un2xs]

You could have posted this in the Flash Bang thread, too.

[Axel]

With the number of players who come in hard for two or three seasons and cycle out to something else it's not surprising. Shoot, the Book of Ecclesiastes is over two thousand years old... "What has been will be again, what has been done will be done again; there is nothing new under the sun." 😁

[flyweightnate]

... and the book of ecclesiastes also has been on the Billboard, in a song by the Birds, making it the oldest lyric to grace the list. A self fulfilling prophecy as it were

[Ecapnation]

Wild card!

Paint quality is at an all time low the last few years

[JeeperCreeper]

I'm happy to say I had a recent and good experience with Nelson Anarchy. It's tiny like everything else, it's very expensive, but it worked well with a .682 for me, only a few rollout here and there.

[ChuckLove]

ketzer7 I believe that is the lowest grade GI paint that has been put in a "Marbalizer" Box. Those were the worst welts I've ever had from playing. The paint just would not break unless it hit a hard surface.

[Siress]

Can confirm that the Anarchy shot very well. I hamfisted (breech drop chop) a few as they are tiny and have a fragile shell (great things if you have bore drop...) which lead to some issues, but aside form that it was aces. I would love love love to get the old pearlescent shell back in the mix - preferably with the pink fill but I know people have emotional damage from past experiences with pink fill.

[The Jayster]

Yet, every single time I play I have to explain the basics to someone. Only the first 6" matters. A long barrel will not make you shoot farther. Rifling is a gimmick where regular paintballs are concerned. Porting only affects the sound signature. Precise bore-sizing is overkill. Better to always slightly overbore with an open-bolt gun. It's all about paint quality.

The only thing where I'm a bit of a contrarian is where GOG (SP) Freak inserts are concerned: aluminium vs SS. I maintain that SS inserts are a bit better because in my experience they don't scratch as easily.

Also, I recently bought a used A-5 on the cheap. It is the newer model, so it comes with the Phenom barrel. I tried it with the stock barrel on and everything else being equal (same paintballs, same Ninja tank), there was no night and day difference with my Emek + Genesis barrel. Of course, the Emek was more consistent overall when I chronoed both guns. However, when I was freely shooting both I did not see that huge of a difference where accuracy was concerned. Some food for thought here...

[JeeperCreeper]

I feel like the stainless ones are more durable when they're not in the barrel. Other than that if it's true to size then it shouldn't matter other than preference.

I want some brass ones for the weight, but aluminum ones are $12-15 on Amazon even for XLs so price always wins for me

[Chappy]

So your saying a blowback is not really inherently any less accurate then anything else? Hmmm, some handsome, intelligent, charming member here has been mentioning this for years…

[The Jayster]

Well, I'm saying that non-blowback markers are on average more accurate, but nowhere near the order of magnitude that is purported. I'll take my A-5 with good paint over my Emek with bad paint any day.

[Axel]

Instant permaban for mentioning Reddit... If I were king 😁

[Siress]

May Painthappy outlive us all.

[Magageddon]

One of the things I did notice recently was using a stainless freak back/aluminum front on my ule automag build, had a much better sound signature for every shot, other than that I've got some unique barrels that for specific markers that definitely perform better than other barrels that I've tried

[Drcemento]

.689 Palmers brass with Wedgits is the one I always go back to. heavy as hell but goddamn. I don't really buy the first 6" argument my best barrels keep that ball retained right in front of the bolt and then let go.
Nelson anarchy and graphiti - so wish it were bigger but I'm still working on doing something about that.... in all I think paint has not completely gone to shit as long as your willing to pay for it. I value accuracy over all else and i can still walk away from a day of play with 4 or 5 very satisfying "put the red dot on whatever body part is poking out and hit it") shots. time really does tend to warp our memories of what paint was.

My argument has always been that what made the older paint "better" was really in its larger size .005+ can really make a difference. Glenn Palmer made mention of it over the year. Mass is good!

[Jonnydread]

I recently grabbed some Anarchy directly from Nelson and it shot great. Still small (~.682ish), but it shot great and broke on target until the humidity took over.

[imped4now]

No "barrel war" is beginning in 2022.

[glaman5266]

Agreed. Bore matching has been around for two decades (maybe more?) and is nothing new. If there was any barrel war it was back when we had a large aftermarket. Even then, it was more about barrel performance vs. cost of the barrel, at least from what I've seen. That generated some decent talking points. Most barrels in the current aftermarket or from the factory on most things above the entry level market shoot well enough where it isn't really a debate.

[Jonnydread]

Mass is good!

Clearly you have never been to the Commonwealth!

[Siress]

You owe us 4% for mentioning the Commonwealth. Namedrop Tax.

[Seajay]

Good good... the thing I just get frustrated over regarding Hammerhead barrels (the old ones) is that still nobody understands that those barrels don't spin the ball, and the lands are flat. The whole point is manipulating the airflow, which is why you have to dial in the velocity. Still the only barrel I've used that can shoot as far or farther at lower velocity (when dialed in correctly) than just a standard barrel shooting at the highest allowed velocity.

It's not better, it's just different, and neat like that. The quality and polishing was very good for the original hammerhead barrels, or at least my Bangstixx is. At this point besides the sizer fin these would also be overborred sized.

[Chappy]

Other then backspin, there is no way for a barrel to impart a change on distance or trajectory once it leaves the barrel. If a ball leaves a barrel at 300 fps, and it is not backspun significantly, all other things being equal, it will shoot identically to any other non spinning ball leaving a different barrel at 300 fps.
If your hammerhead didn’t backspin the ball, and shot a perfect knuckle, what exactly are the physical forces the barrel imparted on the ball that caused it to shoot farther then a different barrel?

Shots fired It’s like BWIII up in here

[ford]

What is dead may never die...

Soviet Russia would not have these problems.

"We have one barrel, it is best barrel on planet. It shoots same or better than all capitalist barrels of lies."

[Axel]

Also we mined the ore, smelted it, cast and extruded the billet, machined, and plated the barrel all at the same site. Everyone in town work there. Best ball paint barrel planet earth.

[woouulf]

Good good... the thing I just get frustrated over regarding Hammerhead barrels (the old ones) is that still nobody understands that those barrels don't spin the ball, and the lands are flat. The whole point is manipulating the airflow, which is why you have to dial in the velocity. Still the only barrel I've used that can shoot as far or farther at lower velocity (when dialed in correctly) than just a standard barrel shooting at the highest allowed velocity.

It's not better, it's just different, and neat like that. The quality and polishing was very good for the original hammerhead barrels, or at least my Bangstixx is. At this point besides the sizer fin these would also be overborred sized.

The first ones were made by LAPCO for Hammerhead so that explains the quality of the polish....