Pump + paint quality

[iamthelazerviking]

Paint quality is going to ruin anyone's day no matter how nice of a marker you're using. Limited and pump play relies on accuracy more than ever and you are only as accurate as the paint will allow. I wish companies dumping money into developing the hottest newest fastest efficientest guns would put that into making better paint.

Anyways, it's been a long time since I've used a pump especially with how random paint quality has been. But from my own recent experiences and Jonny's latest thread about ramping in rec play, I love the idea of embracing pump full on (plus with how far I have to go and less frequently)

For those of you who regularly play pump and only have the option of buying field paint, how do you get around the real bad stuff? Overbore by a good amount and use 3D printed fingers? Still underbore enough to prevent rollouts and hope for the best?

[Jonnydread]

Overbore by a good amount and use 3D printed fingers?

This exactly. When I'm playing open class I shoot my cocker pump with finger detents and a .689 barrel. It will shoot almost any paint with no barrel breaks and reasonable accuracy. In any guns that I run stick feed that don't have the option of finger detents I run a medium underbore and hope for the best. Honestly if the paint is really bad I just stick with OC.

[Jonnydread]

Also, Siress and I have this conversation/friendly argument every 6 months about whether playing pump is worth it with shit paint, I'm sure he'll chime in here.

[RAZRBAKK]

I have mostly moved away from bore matching on anything I'm not trying to get PEAK efficiency out of. Rec play, I use an overbore barrel and some fingers. Lately that means a 685 sizer on my stiffi switch.

If the paint is REALLY terrible I just break out a mech. No point in fighting with it if the field isn't interested in providing at least semi-decent paint.

It sucks, I would like to play stock class more, but as you've mentioned average paint is just not up to it.

[Siress]

This. Quality by volume.

[Chappy]

I shoot my Sniper a lot. Like too much lol I probably should have used a semi for Castle jam but whatever. Anyway I use a 684 lapco barrel and 680 and 676 breech inserts as needed . Honestly I don’t remember the last time I got field paint so bad I couldn’t hit anything. It really hasn’t been an issue for me. If the paints bad enough it’s affecting my day then it’s affecting everyone and the difference comes out in the wash. Honestly I feel when the paint is great it’s more of an advantage to pump then a disadvantage when it’s bad.

[glaman5266]

I wish companies dumping money into developing the hottest newest fastest efficientest guns would put that into making better paint.

Except the only two companies that make both paintguns & paint are GI and Valken. (at least that I'm aware of) And GI has a stranglehold on the market. Why would they change anything when they're making a killing as-is? Many paintball companies are reactive, not proactive. They won't do a damn thing unless consumers and/or the market forces them to.

This exactly. When I'm playing open class I shoot my cocker pump with finger detents and a .689 barrel. It will shoot almost any paint with no barrel breaks and reasonable accuracy. In any guns that I run stick feed that don't have the option of finger detents I run a medium underbore and hope for the best. Honestly if the paint is really bad I just stick with OC.

Yes, this exactly.

Actually, I do all this aside from the medium underbore. I keep it simple & overbore with everything. I just don't pump until I'm ready to shoot. Those two things alone can remove a fair number of headaches.

It's a sad state of affairs when you have to go to the lengths we do to obtain "reasonable accuracy." Current paint isn't worth sizing unless it's a high-end tourney paint with no issues, which no one around me carries. If I do go to a field with paint choices I usually get the more expensive one. It's generally better but not always.

The concept of "reasonable accuracy" being the best that we can do is something that shouldn't even exist. It's bull****. And I blame most of this on GI.

[OpusX]

I get as tight as I can on any sizer to prevent roll outs and just shoot. If I hit, miss, or run out of paint, I still got to play that day.

[coyote]

Build a relationship with the owner or manager of the field.

I have personal phone #s of field owners in my cell. I'll give them a heads up when I'm coming, and when I'm coming with a group. Ask them to order you a great case of paint. Maybe 5-10 of them when you bring company. Pay their price for it .

Don't just be the squeaky wheel. Ask for the oil, and pay for it.

Every one of us players adds or detracts to a fields culture.

[nerdcore]

I bore match to prevent rollouts. I do just as good with that as I do with open-bolt, which is still mediocre at best. Everyone is shooting the same GI field paint, although sometimes I suspect the local team uses whatever stuff they get for practice/events.

[Cdn_Cuda]

I've always underbored my pump and haven't had much issue. Local field paint here hasn't been too horrible, at least for the few times I've played recently. I get more annoyed with paint that doesn't break. You can hit a guy several times and nothing pops.

[iamthelazerviking]

Very true - bounces are much worse

[JeeperCreeper]

Everyone loves good paint. I'm not too picky, as long as it stays together in the barrel and breaks when it reaches its target (the former being the most important.) Even if they were perfectly round, there's gonna be some inconsistencies because it's a fluid filled, round projectile. You just gotta go with it and get closer.

I'll bore match so I don't drop paint, and to help these old Sheridan valves squeeze out a couple extra shots.

[The Great Equalizer]

Who wants to put their money where their mouth is? You can tell I haven't won the lottery because I haven't already done this.
https://www.alibaba.com/product-deta...443784920.html

[iamthelazerviking]

Let's all pitch in. MCB branded paint.

[SETHZILLA!]

Oh man, to be able to shoot fresh, round, large caliber balls and support our forum. SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY!

[Siress]

I would not participate in an alibaba sourced paint run. However, I seem to recall that Nelson would still do custom batches of paintballs after they halted their paintball line. I'd absolutely participate in a custom batch of premium quality paint from Nelson - extra so if we get a silver pearleascent shell with non-staining pink filling. (i.e. Nelson Anarchy Upheaval, just without the staining people complained about with pink filling [which I'm not certain was Nelson - could have been other brands])


Someone needs to be there for the setup of the equipment to verify certain quality metrics. I volunteer. See the link in my signature.

[JeeperCreeper]

The last batch of Nelson Anarchy I got was amazing. Round, consistent, and a bright green fill. That being said, it was $100 a case at the time and I dont go to enough BYOP events to justify buying it. Does it shoot like its worth 1.5x a case of Graffiti? Not really.

Don't get me wrong. It was my favorite paint of all time, but it will remain only as a fond memory.

[Chuck E Ducky]

I have friends in the industry who could definitely help get someone started. But there is a lot more to it than just getting the machine to make them.

1. Gelatin mixing machine: This machine is used to mix the gelatin and other materials that form the outer shell of the paintball. The machine heats the gelatin and other ingredients to a specific temperature and then mixes them to create a consistent solution.
2. Gelatin extruder: This machine extrudes the gelatin mixture into long tubes, which are then cut into small spheres by a cutter.
3. Filling machine: This machine is used to fill the paintballs with paint or other fill materials. The machine uses a piston system to fill the paintballs with a consistent amount of fill material.
4. Drying machine: After the paintballs are filled, they need to be dried to ensure that the gelatin shell hardens. A drying machine is used to dry the paintballs at a specific temperature and humidity level.
5. Sorting machine: Once the paintballs are dried, a sorting machine is used to separate any broken or misshapen paintballs from the batch. This ensures that only high-quality paintballs are packaged and sold.

This is also also after you:

1. Research the market: Before you start your business, you need to have a thorough understanding of the paintball industry. Research your potential customers, competitors, and industry trends to identify opportunities and gaps in the market.
2. Develop a business plan: Your business plan should include a detailed analysis of your market, your manufacturing processes, your marketing strategy, your financial projections, and your organizational structure. This plan will serve as a roadmap for your business and help you secure funding.
3. Obtain funding: Starting a paintball manufacturing business can require a significant amount of capital. Consider your funding options, such as loans, investors, or crowdfunding.
4. Establish your manufacturing process: Your manufacturing process should be efficient and produce high-quality products. You will need to source materials, design your products, and develop a quality control system.
5. Develop your brand and marketing strategy: Your brand should reflect the quality and uniqueness of your products. Develop a marketing strategy that will reach your target audience and differentiate your business from competitors.
6. Establish distribution channels: Consider how you will distribute your products to customers. You can sell directly to retailers or create an online store.
7. Build relationships with customers and retailers: Customer relationships are crucial in the paintball industry. Attend trade shows and events, participate in forums, and offer excellent customer service to build a loyal customer base.

Honestly, I think the investment would be better served creating a better ball. How has nobody created a better ball?

[The Great Equalizer]

I was bored at some point and I think I priced out #1-#3 at about $85k. From the videos I watched they seem to use drying rooms like industrial Powder Coaters use (but at lower temperatures), so I assumed that's built on site by a specialty company.

[Chuck E Ducky]

Yeah I’m thinking $150k minimum to dip your toes into the paint making business.

[Siress]

Perfect Circle (Tom K) and First-Strike (Tom K) are better balls. Both lack the scalability of traditional paintballs (aka softgel), and neither can leverage much of the mature technology developed for gelatin capsules. Perfect Circle required manual assembly, so they are very expensive. Last I heard they were only being used for SFX and some military stuff, but even that info is nearly 20 years old. More importantly, they didn't perform any better than softgel.

The path to success is basically as Chuck E Ducky laid out, but with some technical details worked in... Particularly around packaging, inventory, and distribution.

Potatoe chip bags with dividers to keep weight off the paintballs; no more than a few being supported by any one ball. Inventory gets turned over often and climate controlled - namely temp and humidity. And climate controlled trucks. This adds up to be a very expensive endeavor. However, in sufficiently large quantities (shipping container sized) it could be offset by producing in areas with very low operational expense. I've been involved with products that require being frozen during shipment. The containers are networked, trackable around the world, and contain multiple environmental sensors inside and out along with intrusion detection and cameras. Not relevant here, but at least we're not asking mfrs to go to that extreme. As a paintball MFR, I would at least include environmental sensors to hold the transit companies liable for any damaged batches.

On the topic of inventory, it might make sense to use trays with little cupped bottoms to hold individual paintballs to keep them from dimpling over long durations. Just agitate the rack of trays every once in a while. As the ball rolls around it should rest on a different contact point. Now automate the agitation. Do that in a mobile container with some more engineering to enable efficient bagging, cleaning, and reuse... That'd be clutch to overseas production. Might even arrange a deal with stores to sell them out of these containers before returning them to the MFR.

[iamthelazerviking]

I've been selfish and thinking that if paint sucks then it's just me who will have a hard time landing shots but it will be anyone else using the same paint so ¯⁠\⁠_⁠(⁠ツ⁠)⁠_⁠/⁠¯

[Chuck E Ducky]

Exactly FPO fields everyone is shooting the same stuff so y’all playing on the same paint., Good Bad or Ugly. But limited paint blows with bad paint I agree. Bad paint really grinds my gears. I would happily pay double even triple for a true consistent quality paintball.

[TF_Aloha]

The problem is that this heavily advantages RoF. Inaccurate paint deletes the skill aspect of pump and, in mixed play, creates spray-and-pray vs. pump-and-pray.