Metadyne Thumper/Phoenix Redux

[XEMON]

Yes, the gasket on the fixed side so when the slide comes back is seats against it. I will need to machine a few things to make sure it has the proper clearance and stay in place.
I also bored the barrel holder/slider so the freak insert comes all the way back and the ball sits inside the control bore. It helps tremendously with breaks.

Making a spring guide is gonna be a bit more complicated than on a Sheridan for example, I want it fixed on the body and go all the way through the rear slide to support the spring the entire length. It all needs to be drilled perfectly aligned to not bind.

[Timefreak17]

Custom gasket between the barrel slide and breech? I'm assuming attached to the breech non-moving side.
That is a pretty good move, to help the sealing issue... 🤔.

I haven't had a kink issue (lol) with my return spring yet, but I will heed your advice on a spring guide.

[XEMON]

I made a custom gasket for mine, I need to do more testing and will eventually machine the breach to hold it in place.
A stiffer spring return will need a spring guide so it doesn't reflect to the side and get damaged.

[Timefreak17]

Update: phoenix

So on a observation between my thumper and phoenix, I thought the barrel to breech was too tight for the spring to seat the barrel properly. Leaving a gap that air escapes behind the ball, and forces the barrel forward. The thumper has an oring seal that works very well for this. So took a little sand paper to the back of the barrel ball catch, and a little to the edge of the breech that the barrel ball catch slides over.

After some tweaking I found the phoenix was shooting 384, with the barrel being held in place. And 220 just letting the barrel go do it's thing.

So more adjustment on the velocity adjustment screw, I was getting 280's withe the barrel held back into the breech.

And getting anywhere from 240 to 274 letting the barrel do it's thing.

I believe that a stiffer rear barrel spring will give a more consistent shot fps. This would hold the barrel into the breech with more pressure. Thus allowing more air down the barrel before the barrel gets pushed forward enough to let air escape via the rear breech and nut area.

Also I trimmed the detents to points that worked well still.

Can not tell you break to shot ratio as I was using re-usable rounds.

My next move is stronger spring in the rear.

Thank you for your time, hope this helps some.
Any questions or ideas post I'm up.

[FredMnkyDad10]

So should we wait for version 4-5.

[RuleOfSines]

Yep I’m interested.

[Jonnydread]

I think RuleOfSines was looking for a cheap one awhile back.

[dozernaut]

If anyone wants mine, I'll let it go cheap.

[Timefreak17]

What tools would work for making those adjustments under a normal garage setup. Just hand drills and limited power tools

[JustMrLarz]

Well, despite what I’ve read here, and seen on RuleOfSines’ YouTube channel… I bought one anyway. My Thumper runs great when I use HPA or my PPS 12 gram so maybe I will get lucky here, too.
When I ordered the Phoenix I did request a replacement detent for my Thumper as well, but I haven’t heard back from Scott on that yet. I could print one if I had access to a 3D printer, but I don’t & that’s the only thing keeping me from using it right now.

Despite the issues, I am still excited to have a new tinker-toy. Being able to rock & cock will be a huge win! Having missed cocks on the Thumper because it wasn’t horizontal enough for the pawl to catch was irritating.

[RuleOfSines]

I made a completely new front end for mine in order to get good velocity, I think ended up hitting 290fps at 200 psi maybe? It’s in one of my videos in this thread. Couldn’t get close to that with the stock breech setup.

[Timefreak17]

Thumper vs Phoenix - .685 control bore ac barrel used on both

Thumper- running 650 psi regulated 12g co2
Shooting average 28 rounds per 12g
Fps- Average 267 over 50 shots. Small 8fps swings at times under full pressure and 100fps swings at end of cartridge
full velocity adjustment

Phoenix - running the same 650 psi regulated 12g CO2
Shooting an average 20 rounds per 12g
Fps- Average 244fps over 40 usable shots measured. After dialed in.
The velocity adjuster was run all the way to max then backed off a 1/4 turn.
Also when airing up there was a slight pop of the pistons or valves seating themselves.
Everything ran smooth over 100 shots mechanically. Just not fps wise.
At times it would shoot 340fps then drop to 167 fps. Just wild velocity swings.
Holding the barrel back against the breech while shooting gave me higher fps in 260 to 340 swing range at times.


The phoenix was all over the place in fps. On 12g carts.
I have a feeling it would like 800 psi 12g pressure more, but I believe the mav-3c valve won't like it. Since that valve should be maxed at 300psi based off of valve specs.
I would like more velocity adjustment for lower pressures to keep that valve within operating pressure.

The thumper was consistent the whole time with very little velocity swings until end of the 12g.

Any thoughts on getting more velocity adjustment with lower pressure in the Phoenix?


Update: no ball breaks while firing in either markers. By some miracle.

[XEMON]

It's "the same" but there is huge variation in manufacturing from one batch to the next, some hold perfectly fine with CO2, other self destruct pretty quickly ...

[RuleOfSines]

Just picked up on the New Clippard valve comment, are they saying the valve in the Phoenix is different than the one in the Thumper? Could have sworn I had them both side by side and its the same valve.

[Riot]

Oof. As I was reading it, I was loving what I saw, but I can’t help but feel like we’ve been down this road before. Fool me once… and all that.

That said, I still hope 3.0 is flawless. I feel even though Scott may have been a good dude, the marker, even with Lt. Head-Shots detailed description, isn’t good enough out of the box.

At this point, in my opinion, the ONLY thing they can do is keep working until it’s made right. Anything else would be career suicide (the paintball portion, anyways)

I’ve never shot one, but I did enjoy fondling it at Slim’s last year before it shit the bed immediately. So, should this ever get resolved for real, I’m still in.