(Re)Starting on my long neglected projects...

[LightArmsJXF]

Hi all on MCB,

Thanks to the Carver Air desktop CNC I'd "discovered" a few months back, I decided to order one before pulling my paintball gear out of storage so that I could finally realise the mods I'd imagined back in the day. I wasn't imagining anything particularly over the top back then but there was always that hope that someone else would make the parts that weren't being made. Some things did and I'd managed to buy some of them when I'd had the money. Most things didn't. So, long story short, none of my markers ever got finished properly. Oh well, never mind eh? Anyways, I'm just starting with the CNC milling thing now so it's gonna be slow going to begin with. First thing's first though, I've gotta have something designed in order to mill out some metal.

To that end here's a quick render of my current design. It's a modular clamshell style frame for my Spyder projects so that I could change the trigger/guard setup to a single trigger. It's something I've wanted for almost 20 years but no one else made it. It's base measurements are taken from a combination of the Spyder ESP eFrame and the Raven Nexion eFrame using a combination of digital vernier calipers, radius gauges and 3D printing to check general alignment when compared to the original parts. The single trigger is basically a cut down version of a Warrior Paintball trigger that I'd jumped on when they were first released. The trigger guard itself was inspired by the Beretta pistol trigger guards. Unlike the original Spyder frame, the solenoid isn't secured by 2 grub screws but by the compression of the left side of the frame when it's screwed down. Lastly, another design "must have" for me was the compatibility of grips. I have Dye Sticky3 grips and CIP dragon grips to use so it was imperative that I'd designed to include those in the mix. N.B. Right after I'd done this render I'd changed my mind about the hole(s) on the back of the frame. I have different boards fitted across my Spyders so it'd make sense to have an interchangeable back plate to match whatever board I fit. I'd started the redesign but got a bit side tracked trying to pull out all the different boards to double check measurements.

It's taken me about 2.5 to 3 months of work in Fusion 360 between this and a remake/modelling of a pre-2k Cocker slider frame. Now that I've gotten to this stage I've run into another little problem. The Carvera Air doesn't have enough clearance to mill this Spyder frame standing up to mill the curvature on the top nor the clearance to mill and thread the bottomline holes but I've figured out a little work-around for this problem. I simply need to remove the 15mm thick work-plate so that the model can stand directly on the X-Y Carriage so I've designed and 3D printed a work plate to accommodate this. (I'll post up pics of that once I've got some M5 inserts melted in so that I can show it all test fitted.) Incidentally, the pre-2k cocker frame has a similar issue. The issue that it has is whether or not I can find a milling bit that's long enough to get all the way down into the top to mill out the space required for the slider plate. Once I find a bit that'll do the job I'm sure that I'll have problems with clearance again because the bit has to be quite long.

Like I'd mentioned above I'm just starting out with the CNC thing so I'm pretty sure that my designs are more than likely a bit ambitious (maybe over ambitious) for someone with almost zero "Subtractive Manufacturing" experience. I've just got to work up the courage to not be afraid to waste materials, something that my eternally tormented finances won't appreciate I'm sure, and get cutting that aluminium. In the meantime I'll continue designing for my projects and posting up what I hope I'll be able to mill out sooner rather than later and hopefully it'll all turn out ok in the end.

[flyweightnate]

This looks cool!

Two bits of advice: proof your toolpath in something forgiving first (like wax or MDF)

Carbidetoolsource.com is the best deal out there, when stock levels normalize.

[LightArmsJXF]

Thanks. I'll check them out. Hopefully they'll ship to the UK.

[LightArmsJXF]

Following the above advice from flyweightnate I've ordered some MDF to practice on. In the meantime I'm going to try to remember how to do a Makera CAM setup. I've kinda forgot what I'd learned about it a couple of months ago. That's what I get for getting so absorbed into the design stage, I guess you could say.

edit:
I've been rewatching vids about MakeraCAM setups and [sigh] I'm going to have to rework my model to NOT have threads designed into it. I've tried working around the threaded holes but I'm worried that it'll create a weird offset or misalign holes if I don't do the changes. Not happy about it but it is what it is. I'm so used to designing for 3D Printing that it's taking some getting used to designing things to be CNC'd. I'm generally not that good at modifying my designs at such a late stage because it often goes catastrophically wrong when I make even the slightest change and I've never been able to figure out why. I guess I've just gotta learn how to design things for CNC.

[flyweightnate]

Use BORN (basic ordinal reference node, IIRC) strategy when you model. Constrain sketches and features to your origin, not some previous feature, so when you make a change to one thing it doesn't take everything else with it.

[LightArmsJXF]

Not much of an update but here goes...

Life kinda sidetracked me so no cutting of metal to report. I did buy a load of 150x200mm MDF boards to start practicing with, started setting things up using the masking tape & superglue trick, then got a bit bogged down on "how can I film it without keeping the lid open?" question. I designed a mounting point for my phone and went through a couple of prints to get it sort of working. It was at this point that I got sidetracked because I ran out of clear working space and needed to do something about it. Doing something about it became a bit of a fall down a Gridfinity and Ikea Skadis rabbit hole. This, in turn, sent me looking for an alternative to my compressed air dusters because I've been running low and the cans now cost more and carry 50ml less for the money. I've been considering a compressor for my Paintball HPA tanks for years and figured that I might as well go that route. As luck would have it, the Tuxing compressor that I'd been considering came up in one of our UK charity shops (via eBay) so I nabbed it, saving myself about 1/3 of the cheapest price I could find and also helping out a charity to boot! It arrived today and I'm now filling up the only non-fibre tank I have, a 13ci, which I can use as an air duster with an adapter I'd bought back in the day (circa 2005/6).

Correction- the 13ci tank is filled faster than I could type this update.

[LightArmsJXF]

Orders have arrived!

Today I've received my TippmannParts order.



I've been waiting a while, unsurprisingly, because of international shipping and I've been getting particularly anxious about this order because of what I'd ordered, two A5 trigger frames and a bare 98 Flatline barrel. I didn't know if the 2011 trigger frames would fit, or could be modified to fit, my pre-2011 A5. As it turns out it won't fit right out of the box, I guess I should've looked it up before ordering, but it doesn't look like much modification will be required to get it fitted. Whether it's gonna work afterwards is something I'll find out once it's on.



Looks like I'll need to remove a bit of plastic here.



Good news is that my AirHog grips fit ok. I might put a little sticky bit on the rear end to hold it up but otherwise it looks good.



The 98 Flatline is another thing. How do I remove the tip off the old barrel? I've tried everything that I can think of that won't damage it in some way. I don't have a strong heat source (e.g. a blow torch) to try getting it hot before trying to crank it off so every technique I've tried has been 'cold'. I'd really wanted to reuse it on the new barrel if possible.

[StaticShocked]

Wild idea. If the barrel tip is locktited on, then 250 to 500 degrees depending on locktite type is what is required to soften it to get it to release without damage. Without access to a torch or other fire, you could achieve part of that in the kitchen without a torch using the deep frying method. Deep fry the barrel tip using a deep pan, vegetable oil, and a cooking thermometer. Standard deep frying safety applys obviously like do not exceed like 350 degrees F (depending on elevation) on your oil though and creep up on the temperature so it does not foam over/catch fire. But that could be enough to soften it to allow removal. The barrel tip should be heat soaked through after 5 or so minutes in the hot oil bath. Handle with care.

[LightArmsJXF]

Deep fried barrel? Yum! lol

Honestly though that's one wild idea I would never have considered. Thanks.

[LightArmsJXF]

And then yesterday I'd received my CuratedPB order but forgot to take pics. Aside from CCM Autococker barrel backs/sizers (which are now packed away with the marker they were intended for) I'd also received this CCM barrel that's been Freak bored.


It's not been done fully though because the inserts sit 0.4mm proud instead of flush with the end. I'm not sure how to go about fixing that.



I'd also got volumizers for my Angel 05 Speed. I'd wanted equal length ones on both sides but got a bit confused about what fits on what version of Angel. I saw these and took a chance. Luckily they fit. I'm not bothered about colours at the moment because I'm intent on getting things reannodised at some point anyway.





Then there's volumizers for my Spyders. I bought 3 of these, thinking these would look better than the stock Shutter one (on the left) while still keeping with the aesthetic. I was right (or, at least, I think so) but it won't fit unless I remove the Shutter's barrel shroud. I really think it loses something when the shroud isn't there so I'm going to have to modify something, either the volumizer or the shroud, to make them both fit at the same time.



I'd also received a TechT iFit kit (eBay purchase) that I wanted for my Spyders but I don't have a Spyder back yet. TechT haven't answered my email enquiry (are they still in business?) and there's only 1 available via MCS in the UK. I'm thinking I'll need at least 3 so that they can be anodised for different projects.

[LightArmsJXF]

I was watching a video of a 2011 A5 teardown and noticed that the little tombstone latch was missing on their A5. The slot for it and its spring were still there but the two of them weren't present/fitted and so weren't there to hinder the fitment of the newer 'selector switch' frame. This got me thinking that all I'd need to do was remove them from my pre-2011 A5 in order to make it fit and, lo and behold, that's literally all I did and now it fits! I haven't gassed it up yet but the marker does cock & hold and releases on a pull of the trigger the same as with the old frame, no physical mods needed, no cuts necessary.

It ain't much but little wins are still wins!

[LightArmsJXF]

Here's the update that I was hoping to do at the end of last week. Stage 1 of my modular/clamshell Spyder E-Frame prototype done!

This is most of the left side milled out so that when I mill out the right side to the same point I can fit them together to mill all the holes & mill threads together so that everything aligns as they should. Then I can radius the left side before flipping over and doing the same to the right side. At that point I'd need to tackle the top radius and vertical holes on both top (to mount to the upper receiver) and bottom (with threads for the bottomline).

I started cutting on the 5th of July but, in between my CNC inexperience and the extreme heat we're having over here in the UK, it's taken me this long (10 Days) to get this far. Things are also being hindered by the fact that my design needs smaller bits than I've got (more have been ordered) and it also needs slight tweaking because the programs keep bringing up a particular error message about the holes being too small for M3 threads, even though I thought I was following the instructions about sizing for the drill (2.4mm or 2.5mm) correctly to have material to cut the threads. I'm working on that now, now that the temperature in my room is cool enough to no longer give me migraines.

I did get a bit over eager and removed the piece before it was ready but it looks like I'd managed to get it back into position ok, managing to avoid serious misalignment issues for the last few fine passes. Overall, I'm quite pleased with the results so far. I'd designed the frame to basically be a mid point between the Spyder ESP E-Frame and the Raven Nexion E-Frame, which are essentially the same but slightly different from one another. Overlaying the piece on the right side of either of both frames shows me that my measurements were pretty close to identical over all the points that I was aiming for so I'm happy.

On a side note, the milling process actually left some layer lines that might become useful. The clapper solenoid area has horizontal grooves that might come in handy to 'grab' the solenoid housing when I tighten the sides together. That'll help limit rotation during use, methinks. I'll have to wait and see when the right side is done. I hope I'm right. The other, obvious grooves to the front of the frame were an accident and have to real use/purpose. I'd used a large bull nose mill thinking that it'd give a cleaner finish but it cut channels instead and no other passes with a flat end mill corrected it for some unknown reason, even though the setup should've cut to the same depth (see the vertical line on its left end for reference). I really don't know what I'd done wrong there and I really don't want to cut away more material at this point, just in case. There are blemishes here and there, things that no amount of polishing and anodising can cover up, but I think my results thus far aren't too shabby for an absolute beginner, even if I am being a bit over-ambitious with my first CNC project.

[scottieb]

I like it! Different options for trigger guards is a great thing.

[LightArmsJXF]

Yesterday marked a CNC milestone for me. My first snapped CNC bit!
I was almost done with that particular part of the process when the 2mm end mill sheared itself in half. It simply didn't like the masking tape & superglue combo and got a bit gunked up. Bad point is that I can't see where it caused any damage (if any damage occurred).
Things don't look bad as far as I can see but I'm sure I'm going to find out after I've finished and pull this half of the frame off of the bed.

Anyways, after ordering a replacement end mill, I figured I'd do something about my air duster. Macroline was letting way too much air out and I was having to recharge my tank a lot more often than I'd hoped. I'd thought about getting a thin needle nozzle like the ones to inflate sport related balls but couldn't find one that I could be confident would fit on a 1/8NPT threaded hole. I toyed with the idea of buying a new set of 4mm microline but wasn't keen because I'd rather spend the money elsewhere (parts, tooling, materials, etc.). I then remembered that I'd got some microline sitting in my spares from when I'd unsuccessfully tried to fix a friend's pump marker. This is what happened a few minutes later...

Microline fitting with a short piece of microline... with a straw from an air duster can pushed into it. Surprisingly it makes very little difference to air consumption but it does make the air jet more focused and a bit more powerful because of it.

Last pic while I wait for replacement bits to arrive.:
Test fit of the left side onto the right.

There's a couple of points where the dimensions appear to differ, something I'm a bit confused about at the moment, but otherwise it's looking nice so far. I'm hoping things will sort themselves out as I continue on.

[LightArmsJXF]

I've just remembered a "sort of plan" for an Autococker build and I was wondering if anyone knows where I can get a hold of some VF Tactical parts, namely the additional rail bits and front block, or how much they're currently (re)selling for. I don't want to post a WTB thread just yet. I just need to know if I'm going to have to abandon this idea because it's no longer economically viable or if I have to give up simply because the parts just aren't available any more.

[LightArmsJXF]

Finally managed to get myself a Q-Loader kit after all these years!

I'd wanted one of these kits since they'd first come out 'way back when' but kinda left paintball, or set it aside, before I figured out the build I'd wanted it for. Then they were discontinued and I only found that out years after that had happened.


I still don't have a firm plan for a build but I figured that I'd better not miss this opportunity to get a kit, especially seeing as I'd missed out on a complete kit (note the matching Q-Loader pod pack that isn't present) because I was busy 'umm-ing and ahh-ing' over whether or not to go ahead with it.

Now that it's in my hands I can feel a little more relaxed about deciding what build it's going to be.

Last addition, also in the pic, is the polished silver Whacko Cocker barrel. I'm short a few barrels for my Cocker projects and I knew I'd have to have this when I first saw it. Now I have to try it out on my projects to see where it looks its best.

[LightArmsJXF]

Alrighty Then! This weekend the temperature has, at last, cooled down enough for my room to be an actually tolerable working space. Unfortunately that gave me an opportunity to mess up my Spyder trigger frame.



I noticed weird artefacts happening as the process went on. Trying to correct them destroyed the tighter tolerances I'd tried to design in and cut one trigger guard mounting point in half. My sear is now so loose in its space that I'd need a ton of washers to centralise it.


One good point, however, is that the clapper solenoid is held in as well as I'd hoped.



It does stick out of the right side a bit more than the left though so I'm going to have to recheck my measurements again. I can't remember if this is the way it's supposed to be on the ESP frame. If it is then I'll count myself lucky and leave it alone but I thought that it was supposed to be centered so I'm really not sure.

All-in-all this failure is a learning experience more than anything else. I have to redesign my model or, more precisely, I need to roll back my design for better CNC milling. I need to design in a flat top because the internal radius that it's supposed to have in the final finish is creating a lip of extra material, extra that caused me to screw things up when I tried to remove it, and design in extra material to the outer of the model so that I can mill a uniform outer contour when I 'cut out' the frame. I'm also going to redesign my trigger guard to be a little less blocky. It was bothering me every time I looked at it so, seeing as I'm having to redo the main body of the frame, I might as well do the guard at the same time. When milling out the guard (and the little blanking part that goes with it) I'm going to have to remember to add tabs to stop them from coming loose during milling. The masking tape & superglue trick isn't enough to hold them down. That trick is also causing other issues with gumming up the bits as I try to cut past it so I'm going to try the double sided tape that came with the Carvera Air kit. If that doesn't work then I'm going to have to rely on clamps but I'm going to have to buy some low profile M6 screws/bolts because the Aluminium bed that I'd bought to replace the stock MDF bed has M6 holes instead of M5s, which is annoying.

In the meantime I figured I'd take this moment of having a clear bed to mill some clearance on my Spyder barrel shrouds so that I can fit that volumizer.



It's worked a treat. Before I would have to remove the barrel just to put the shroud on, only to find that the volumizer would stop me from fitting it.




After milling I can now just slip it straight on without removing anything!




The amount of material removed is so minimal that I'm wondering why it wasn't just done by Kingman to begin with. (Left are AMG shrouds, right are TL shrouds)



I guess that they weren't concerned about people fitting aftermarket parts. Anyhoo, I'm going to see if my modification also allows me to use something like the CIP Assault Block now. I vaguely remember that I couldn't fit one on my Shutter way back when all because of the shroud that I wanted to keep in place. I hope it does.

[LightArmsJXF]

I checked it the other day whilst going through my spares but forgot to take pics and so I forgot to post about it. The CIP Assault Block does indeed fit now that this little bit of material has been removed. In fact all of my volumizers can now be screwed in without any fitment issues. I still need to remove the shroud in order to change the VASA block. Not really a problem but I figured it was worth mentioning. I haven't tried the 1st gen Trinity reverse 15 degree VASA yet, which was a bit chunky IIRC. I wouldn't think it'd be any different in fitment though.

[LightArmsJXF]

Progress on the revisions of my frames is slow going so here's a little 'not related to that' update.

I'd seen the Pre-2k Autococker external velocity adjuster thread by Hellion360 and jumped on it when he said it's up for grabs. fast forward to today and it's arrived!




I could barely wait to fit it so, after a bit of rummaging for screws and parts, I fitted it to my Pre-2k Mini-Cocker pump project.


I honestly thought I didn't have a beavertail that'd fit but I actually had one amongst my spares. Then, as a weird twist, the cocking rod that I know I have somewhere because it was with this marker when I'd bought it, is missing!?! That being said I'm not sure if it'll fit now. The back block for this kit is so chunky it simply might be too short. I don't know where I'll find the correct size rod to make things work and, being in the UK where Metric is the standard for threads and such, I don't really have the stuff to make/cut my own Imperial/UNF/UNC threads. I'm not even sure what thread size it is. 10-32 perhaps? I vaguely remember something about that size being somewhere for Autocockers. I guess I'll have to add another thread die to my ever growing list of 'tooling to buy'.

[LightArmsJXF]

Second twist... the other pre-2k cocking rod I had for my full body pre-2k, which had the full rear block, is also missing. I've gone through all my Autococker spares and neither is anywhere to be found. I'm going to have to go through all the spares for all my other markers just in case I've accidentally chucked it in with something else.

edit:
I found them! I'd actually put them aside when I was reorganising a few months back and I'd totally forgot to put them in with the rest of the Cocker projects.

[LightArmsJXF]

I've got some stuff from Sweden of all places. I'd never considered looking in that direction of the world for anything paintball related so I was quite surprised when I found a place that was selling some Spyder parts.



Spyder Detent Covers - I needed a few of these but I wasn't sure about part numbers. There were 4 aluminium ones on the site so I ordered 1 of each thinking that there was only one type but, unfortunately, I was wrong. There's 2 different lengths for some reason and all I needed was the short ones. Never mind though. I'm slowly getting to the end of the task of changing out all the silver parts for black on my Shutter.




Stuff for my Spyder MR-1:
MR Series Metal Stock - The MR-1 that I'd bought 'many moons' ago didn't come with the shoulder stock, something that I wasn't aware it was supposed to have, but I wasn't bothered because I had a JCS folding stock that I could use on it. Fast forward to 'nowadays' and I'd decided that the JCS didn't look right on it but I couldn't find the OEM stock. This one is metal and is too tight a fit (I basically can't remove it without a hammer now). I don't know who made it either but I think it looks a helluva lot better than the JCS one did.
Inspire MR Series Aluminium Feedneck - I was considering trying to make something like this so that idea was scrapped after seeing this for sale. It's a threaded piece with a clamping feedneck screwed into it. I don't know what threads it is, probably Ion, but I guess that doesn't really matter. I just wanted something tougher than the plastic elbow I've got.



Other Bits:
Spyder Chargers - I'd managed to lose my Spyder charger so I didn't just order a replacement car socket charger, I got a wall socket charger as well (albeit a Euro style plug but I can get an adapter if I can't find the one I know I've got somewhere).
Valve Screws - I needed a couple for a couple of TL bodies I'd bought recently from IISports.

CNC Stuff Update:
I'm still reworking my trigger frame models. I'm still having trouble getting my head around the workflow organisation bit. I'm so used to just designing something to completion and letting my 3D printer get on with the task. CNC basically requires that I break things down into stages of completion in order to get the results I'm aiming for, or that's how it seems to me at this point.
So far I've added extra material around the perimeter that can be removed at a later stage. I've removed the top curve on the Spyder frame, again adding extra material to be removed at a later stage, which will prevent some of the issues I'd been experiencing on my first attempt. My Pre-2k Cocker frame is now a 2-Piece because I don't have confidence that I can consistently/precisely mill the top slot. I've also added extra material around perimeters.
I've also side-tracked myself, as I often tend to do, by figuring out that I need to mount my Xin Dian self centring vise vertically somehow. This meant having to rework a design for a mounting plate that I'd got off of Makerworld and combining it with the standard corner block of the Carvera Air. I've just finished designing that as a 2-piece mount and I'm now refining it a bit before I attempt to cut metal.

"Sort of unrelated" update:
I've decided to get 'Rainbow'/'Aurora' Titanium Grade 2 (TiGr2) screws for my Spyders. It's only for my Spyder projects at the moment due to the fact that everything I've found so far is Metric. All the Imperial (UNF/UNC) TiGr2 screws that I find are silver but if I find some 'Rainbow' ones I'll do it to all my projects. I've gotten a bit fed up with stripping steel hex heads lately so I'm hoping that the TiGr2 ones will hold up better. Not to mention that I think the 'Rainbow' effect does look really nice (see above pic of my Shutter's detent cover). I'm a bit confused as to why the heads have a smaller outer diameter but they still hold properly so I'm not that bothered by the difference. Lastly, why is it that they're no longer called 'Aurora' like they used to be? It's still the same effect/finish. Not really important, I know, but I was introduced to this effect as 'Aurora' on parts back in the mid 00's so it just kinda bugs me.

[scottieb]

I am just now finding this thread. This is great!