Have a work question, policy

[punkncat]

We have finally reached a point in our business growth that we have need of an employee handbook. We have consulted with someone on some "legal-ize" and have run across something we don't know if we can implement. We are located in GA

We swapped over from contract labor a few years ago. All of our employees are hourly now.

We are wanting to implement a clause in the handbook that if the worker don't turn in paperwork in a timely manner that they will not be paid for the hours in question. I know that if they were contract labor we CAN do that because the lack of paperwork is not fulfilment of the contract term(s).

Can we NOT pay an hourly employee when they don't turn in paperwork (job specific)?

edit to say: There doesn't seem to be a super clear and easily understood situation going on here. From what I can find it is not legal to withhold any type of pay deduction that would bring the worker under minimum wage. That does not apply.
The only other thing we can specifically find on this is that IF the employee is notified of this as a part of the "work contract" that it is, indeed, legal. The thing that is muddy is to whether it's legal to implement after employment?

Who would be the person or entity to contact to find out such?

[Flounder]

Not an expert or professional but have read a lot of labor law. If your employees are hourly you need to pay them for the hours worked. Maybe you can pay a lower wage and then offer a bonus plan for paying them extra when paperwork is complete.

[punkncat]

Not an expert or professional but have read a lot of labor law. If your employees are hourly you need to pay them for the hours worked. Maybe you can pay a lower wage and then offer a bonus plan for paying them extra when paperwork is complete.

Thanks for the reply. Apparently this is VERY muddy ground. Our owner consulted the lawyer that we utilize (he is not a labor law specialist) and he wouldn't touch it.
An alternate idea would be to penalize the employee after a set time with unpaid days off. This appears to fall under a legal disciplinary action.

[Flounder]

Hire better people?

[BrickHaus]

Hire better people?

Thats not as easy as one thinks these days.

[Shaftski]

I wouldn't touch a policy that affects someone's pay like that. Someone could make an honest mistake and wind up not getting paid, not covering rent, groceries, etc. It could really screw up someone's life.

Implement 3 strikes. Do it 3 times you are gone. Written warnings after each incident signed by a witness.

[punkncat]

Hire better people?

Thats not as easy as one thinks these days.

I truly wish it was. We commonly find ourselves in a situation where we cannot properly discipline a person because then we have no one to complete the work, and no one to replace them. These damned stimulus packages have eroded the work ethic of large groups of people whom didn't have much of one to start with. Good people really ARE hard to find.

[punkncat]

I wouldn't touch a policy that affects someone's pay like that. Someone could make an honest mistake and wind up not getting paid, not covering rent, groceries, etc. It could really screw up someone's life.

Implement 3 strikes. Do it 3 times you are gone. Written warnings after each incident signed by a witness.

It's really easy for people not to realize how this works, up the chain.

We do inspections and service for a national company that requires very specific paperwork and procedure to be followed. As part of OUR contract, if we are late turning the documentation in, or if it's incomplete, they can and will deduct 10% + from our payment. As I am sure you ARE aware, there is a super competitive market out there for almost anything and in many cases 10% can be the difference in profit, or not with some of the work we do.

We have tried a variety of methods to try and get this across to the employees and nothing seems to work, keeping what I wrote in the previous reply in mind. I know that on a personal level nothing gets my attention MORE than having my pay fucked with....

[Shaftski]

The last startup I was in we had weekly doc submissions required to our financiers. If things were late for the sat evening call, things were late getting transferred into our bank accounts. Total shoestring budget.

CEO tried to hold back pay of anyone who did not submit by 5PM, it was outsourced HR folks who pushed back saying violation of labor law. Min wage had to be paid at least. This was also true when the bank acct was running dry towards the end and payroll could not be covered. Everyone had to be paid minimum and made square later on. This was true regardless of hourly or salary.

So if it's legal....Best course is withold pay to min only until paperwork rec'd. Strike one. Repeat to 3 strikes and they are gone. All depends on your state's laws though.

But yeah. Lawyer up, get a good one, make the policy crystal clear.

[maggot]

Going to play devil's advocate for a minute. Given the fact that no handbook has been created to date, I'd say it's likely that there isn't any defined business process for your folks to follow. Providing them that playbook and ensuring that they have the time available to properly fill out the necessary paperwork may deliver better results than telling them repeatedly.
Implementing 3 strikes would be a good thing to follow up with too.

As much as filling out paperwork may be an afterthought for employees, it's often an afterthought for businesses to schedule the time for them to do it as well. "Just do it" or "Make time" don't usually result in it actually getting done. That breeds contempt on both sides.

[punkncat]

Thanks for the comments. Yes, we have come a LONG way in the 6 years since I/we have taken over management and operations. We are in a far, far better place than we were in those days. Along with that we are trying to get these things done so we can cross that threshold into the realm of "real" companies with real consequences.

[EvilCreature]

I am an attorney in Minnesota but do not work in the employment law field because it is not something you "dabble" in but need to have a depth of knowledge to avoid making a mistake. All I will say is that the money you spend on a competent employment law attorney will probably be saved multiple times over if an issue ever arises.

[punkncat]

A common term I keep coming across trying to research this is "pay now, or pay later". I agree. Thank you for your comments.

[EvilCreature]

Yeah, our slogan is "Before you sign" call us.

[Paintslinger16]

Hour worked = Hours paid, I don’t think you can ever withhold money like that federal law. You would probably be better off having daily supervisor signing off on the work done or completed. Make policy to that effect, that one is enforceable, and two has consequences.

[punkncat]

We had one. He was a shitbag and stole from the company. We had to let him go and we can't find anyone stable enough to take the spot.

[Paintslinger16]

Still falls on the company for compliance, if you don’t have one then it’s you.

[Tarsun2]

what is it that the company does? does it require special training/certs or is this something that someone right out of college/ high school do?
im always surprised when a company/business has a hard time not only finding employees but, candidates even.... it seems like the focus is always on the minimum wage with "no other options available", yet so many businesses are struggling to find people to fill positions.

[ford]

Older Millennial answer here... make everyone salaried, base quarterly bonuses dependent on benchmarks like getting paperwork done on time.

sorry finding good people is such a pain. This ‘recovery’ is really sporadic.

[Cyberpyr8]

Shameless plug, but I work for a PEO (Professional Employer Organization). You should consider using one since our company would handle all of that plus your benefits and payroll. We cover legal and ethical issues for all sorts of industries. You could have everything spelled out to the employees and you would know what you legally could or couldn't do. I work in the IT department so I'm not the person to answer or ask HR questions to! But I know we help over 300k employees get paid every month and their companies stay out of legal trouble as much as possible. We also help out when legal issues do arise. Something to think about.

[chrislognshot]

this might not fly. We are wanting to implement a clause in the handbook that if the worker don't turn in paperwork in a timely manner that they will not be paid for the hours in question. for this to work need to get lawyer. your best bet is get lawyer or company that help people make employee hand books. because you can not put thing in it that wil take money from someone with out it be legal to do so. forcing someone if do not turn in on time does mean lost of wages, but more write up and if get to many get fired. you can not take money away from someone on clock with out it being legal under the law. have to find another way to solve issue.