why no more new nelsons?

[jetenginekyle]

Seems like it should be possible to make quality nelson markers that blow phantoms out of the water given how expensive those have gotten,~$350 for a back bottle valved stock class phantom. If meteor and nova can make snipers for 500 then why cant a nelson be made for 200? At that price it would compete with phantoms and azodin's pumps and as long as its done right would be better. So why hasnt it been done yet? Its been a few years since Mike left and ev cranked the price of phantoms so there been time for something to be released, yet... nothing

[Ecapnation]

I do not think there is much market for such an item anymore. Carters were niche. Phantom were ubiquitous and always available. The empire tracer was an interesting entry but sort of failed to take the market. Even Tippmann introduced the sl68 again but it just sort of Hit the market with a thud and nobody cared.

The problem is it looks great on paper but ultimately sales were never great and that's the bottom line.

[RAZRBAKK]

The PRP was the last new Nelson IIRC.

While I would personally love a new Nelson to sink some money into, I don't think they appeal to most players. They are synonymous with stock class, but outside of some pockets of players who are mostly on MCB, who is playing stock class anymore?

I think there is probably a market for a higher quality magfed Nelson, as the Hammer7 is still very desirable despite being made by Kingman.

Outside of that it's a tough sell.

[Ecapnation]

The prp was a flop at best

[Ecapnation]

Also just putting this out there before somebody brings it up bob longs MVP...

Everyone always says why don't they make more they're selling at such a high price right now. The reality of that resale price is there were so limited because nobody bought them to begin with. When I ordered one from Zack he literally told me I was probably going to be only one of 150 people that bought them. And that was when my cost on them were around $400 wholesale. They just simply didn't sell. The secondary market is result of something being so niche people want them.

Same with Carter's originally it was up to a year wait to get one but why wait when you can get a used one for a couple hundred more. Now that market is just inflated because it was passing.

The meteor pump is a unique case in that a well-respected and liked company came out with something rather inexpensive and it's sold like hotcakes. I don't think there really is much of a pump market and a lot of people were buying those just to convert them into cockers

[russc]

Gotta remember that the MVP was terrible out of the gate. The pump stroke and farting totally ruined them and they were selling very cheap until they were fixed with aftermarket mods. Empire sniper also had issues with cocking slot being too short...lots of companies put out product that just hadn't been beta tested by experienced pump players.

[Ecapnation]

I used a slp reg on the MVP I had never had farting issues....... I hated the lock point of the pump stroke but I was given the cad file for the hammer sear to tinker with and improved that.

It wasn't perfect but definitely better then the empire sniper

[Grendel]

They are expensive because there are only a few of them. There are only a few of them because they are expensive. To not be a niche market there has to be mass demand and while they seem popular here and on niche FB pages in reality the demand for Nelson clones is tiny in comparison to the overall demand for paintball products.

[Ecapnation]

I came across a bunch of nos raw taso frames and unibodies and thought about releasing a limited run of pumps but it wasn't viable because of the costs to machine everything else and Anno them.

The break even price would of been $500 a unit and that was going to be a basic nelson that in the 90's would cost like $150

[Jonnydread]

One thing that hurts the viability of a new Nelson is IMO they are harder to transition into from other forms of paintball than Sheridan-based platforms. If I'm trying to get someone into pump I'll loan them a pump cocker vs. a Phantom as the learning curve is a bit more gentle.

There just doesn't seem to be much demand for new pumps in general, at least not until we eat up all the random cocker parts and back of the closet Trracers.

[chrislognshot]

pump is niche to many. a lot of people do not want to play pump over these fact. you can not hold a lot paintball or shot a lot of paintball fast. your out gun in how much paintball they spray and pray to hit target just move up on someone. i been in that spot where to many semi around me to spray and pray to hit me just so other people on there team can get me from different side.

[iamthelazerviking]

There's really only so much you can do to improve the Nelson based "system" and CCI already did all that. You could argue the RTR Gargoyle, but the funkiness, limited quantities, and pricetag on those don't make them very feasible.

[flyweightnate]

I'm looking at it differently - the challenge with nelsons is cost of manufacture. It requires more pieces in hard metals than a Sniper, and those pieces are trickier to make. To make it in the US, it's expensive. If you're going to China, you want enough volume to offset logistics.

Once I get some stuff done, I'm going to take a look at it, though. I'd love to see more fields with stock class rental fleets.

[JonM]

It's not just cost too. With the exception of a few pump events (often hosted by one of us), pump play really seems to by dying off in general. Many fields really aren't designed with pump play in mind either, favoring layouts that promote shooting higher volumes of paint. If players want limited paint these days, it seems like magfed is getting more attention these days than pumps do. I can probably count on one hand the number of new pump markers you can buy today. It's not just Nelson pumps that are falling off the market - all of them are.

[Nish]

There is also the high volume of functioning/mostly functioning older guns that were mid/high quality that are available.

[Grendel]

^ this, supply and demand. I can put together out of my inventory between 12-15 Nelson clone markers most being made out of NOS parts or low use parts markers. I have put a lot of the parts and markers for sale before and rarely get any serious bites. Actually getting ready to do so again so you who want Nelson clones or Phantoms better be ready to buy

[Snowpuff]

I'll be making a small batch of double tracers by next spring

[Ecapnation]

Ok ... But are you making new tracers?

[KMDPB]

It has been done, it's called the JT Er2. <50 bucks

[Grendel]

It has been done, it's called the JT Er2. <50 bucks

Not what I would call a "good" nelson clone. Hell I'm not a fan of Tracers either, call me a Nelson Clone Snob