Would Spoolies shoot as accurate as closed bolts with correct size paint?

[Pumps4ever]

As the title states...

I remember using regular sized .689 paint with my old pumps back in the late 80's and it was as accurate as you could point...

You aimed, pulled the trigger and the ball flew straight for 125ft atleast and hit the target exactly where you aimed...and I mean exactly...

So question is... if we finally did get regular sized paint would spoolies shoot as straight as a closed bolt?

I know it will all be speculation until we get some good paint but inquiring minds...

[JohnB]

This was a great debate when spoolies took over. I think the end of it was - theoretically they the autococker would be more accurate but in real life the non uniform paint made them basically the same. Paintball is just not really an exact sport imo

[StaticShocked]

My gut says no they would not just due to the sudden acceleration and movement of the ball from the bolt in a cylinder of a larger size (allowing deformation and movement of the liquid inside the ball) which is then violently crammed into a smaller cylinder before being shot. But that is just my gut talking (or was that lunch...). I would think if you were firing a closed bolt at 10 bps and a spooly at 10 bps, they would be the same accuracy (all other factors being the same) since the ball would be experiencing the same level of distortion and motion prior to being shot.

All other factors being equal; I would think that the main issue is disturbance of the liquid inside the ball before being shot. Assuming a single shot situation: A closed bolt lets the ball rest before being shot so allowing a more stable projectile while an open bolt agitates it immediately before shooting it thus causing possible disturbance in the liquid inside the projectile possibly causing fight path variation? I am just guessing here. Not at all my area of study or expertise but it sounded reasonable in my head.

[uv_halo]

In controlled testing, in the peak of the industry in the early post 2000s, no paintball gun design (pump. open bolt, closed bolt, no bolt) showed any significant difference in accuracy. Don't take this personally but, I don't believe anyone when they say that a mostly-spherical, 3 gram projectile, with a measurable seam, will fly perfectly straight for 300ft, because:

1. They can't fly farther than 282ft without a serious tailwind, or a significant backspin (i.e. Apex or flatline barrel)
2. Being only 3.1 grams, and .68 caliber (not dense), they are terribly impacted by winds you can not reliably feel.
3. With the seam in a different orientation from shot to shot, this alone will increase the randomization of the trajectory from one shot to the next.

The only thing I've ever seen (Testing by a youtube user named rntlee) that measurably and consistently improved the flight of a paintball beyond not using a purely crap barrel, was actually providing a paintball with a sabot (muzzle loading a paintball in a patch of paper towel in an over-bored barrel). This made a noticeable improvement in the measured spread. I believe because this effectively allows the balls to leave the barrel with next to zero spin. Unfortunately, this is such an impratical thing to do, it's never gone anywhere.

[MrKittyCatMeowFace]

But weren't people regularly shooting well over 300fps back in the day? sometimes 350+
Would that have a big impact on range and accuracy?

[uv_halo]

MrKittyCatMeowFace Speed doesn't impact accuracy directly. They will simply deviate due to spin, vortex shedding, being out of round, quicker. They also slow down faster so, a 360FPS won't have a proportional increase in distance. But, the faster you are going at any one point, the less wind influences you.

[Pumps4ever]

So I eyeballed the distance that I used to shoot accurately back in 1989 to get the 300ft.

Well I just used the Daft Logic Distance Calculator and I was def off... and a whole lot I guess.

After measuring using the distance calculator I can accurately say the distance I remember shooting perfectly on target was roughly 125 feet.

[Magmoormaster]

I cannot believe we are having this conversation in the year of our Lord 2026.

Closed bolt guns are in no way more accurate than open bolt guns. So like, yes. A spool valve gun will be as accurate as a closed bolt.

[Blackmagic71]

Everybody here knows the marker you just sold and then had sellers remorse for was the most accurate and best shooting marker ever made.

[BrendanB]

I think slightly over boring provides more consistent accuracy but efficiency decreases because of not bore matching.

ive seen closed bolt guns shoot terrible, and shoot good. Ive hardly ever seen a spool shoot terrible, Ive seen poppets shoot bad mostly because of inconsistent air.
It's all a mixed bag.

[BrendanB]

what's significant? I mean over boring def spins out ball like a sliced golf ball.

[JohnB]

I agree with this. I thought there was testing that said underbore or overbore are more accurate than bore match. I choose overbore for less breakage.

[uv_halo]

RPP Thanks for bringing that up! The poster of that video (rntlee) was very involved in dialogs with myself and the punkworks group. I think he got some of the inspiration of this test setup from them. IIRC, the consensus at the time is that this showed a trend but, wasn't statistically different enough to really matter- he even says as much in the comments of that video. One area of concern about the testing relates to the idea of removing outliers. In firearms this is often done to reflect limits of the testing (i.e. bag rested testing where the shooter 'pulls' a shot). For a paintball, it would make sense to track windspeed and discount shots with significantly more wind than the others but, just arbitrarily calling something an outlier isn't optimal.

[Cyberpyr8]

Paint is the problem, always. I put first strike rounds in my EMF100 and shoot ball on ball using a laser dot and target at 150 feet. Same setup and using round ball and the difference is crazy. While some are within an inch or two of the target, they are not nearly as close in a group of 10 or 20. That's a spool, using the same tank, barrel (689 CP one piece) and marker and it's more accurate (with FSR) than anything else I have ever shot.

Even with a pump the roundball inconsistencies are a problem. I think with a pump players tend to aim better, mostly because you have to. I hit crazy shots with my EMF mostly because it's longer I think and it feels more natural to shooting real steel, but with roundball you aren't as consistent. I don't think that the spool, poppit or whatever makes a difference. The paint is the equalizer in all of them. If you could shoot FSR in something other than an magfed marker I bet you wouldn't believe the accuracy, or lack thereof in the same marker with roundball. You would hate your pump with roundball if you could shoot FSR in it a few times.

[Painthappy]

Hahahahaha.... Cockers rule.

[uv_halo]

Two Words: ICE Epic

[Jonnydread]

A bolt? We're too high to engineer a bolt!

[uv_halo]

I cannot believe we are having this conversation in the year of our Lord 2026.

Closed bolt guns are in no way more accurate than open bolt guns. So like, yes. A spool valve gun will be as accurate as a closed bolt.

I think the biggest reason why this information keeps being re-submitted by EXPERIENCED but uninformed players is a testament to how easily we are fooled by our eyes (seeing patterns where there is none) and our bias (I just bought this very expensive barrel kit, it should work better than the tube that came with the gun).

For new players, there are tons of invalid equivalents from other projectile industries/games that simply don't translate, barrel length, bolts, or even rifling,

[Jsc5150]

I’ll tell you what I tell the renters:

Pumps are more accurate bc you actually have to aim

Your garden hose could be accurate as a laser pointer but you’d never know

[BrickHaus]

I
Pumps are more accurate bc you actually have to aim

I find this to be accurate, its the forward bias of your off hand pulling the marker towards the target that helps accuracy, along with the longer grip length.

Now. On the note of spoolies being less accurate. I personally believe some truth to that, not due to actual inconsistencies between shot to shot velocity. Not because they are open bolt or closed bolt. Current paint is really small, and spoolies typically have a larger breech due to the bolt, and can assemblies they use to function. I do honestly think a lot of spoolies stack clip paint of the modern age without some work, the pre crack in shells causes inconsistencie. Two years ago I would have called my own, above statement laughable. But Myrkul has shown me the difference of markers with and without beveled bolts due to this theory. I think hes much smarter than he gives himself credit for.

[Rotozip2]

The biggest downfall to modern accuracy is going to be the poor quality paint we have now. I quit playing for.10 years and now all the sudden oblong and flat spotted paint is the new standard now.

[gabe]

Most accurate gun I've owned was a Shocker CVO. Running a slight overbore .685 insert that gun shot darts with whatever paint I fed it.

I don't think open bolts or spool guns are universally more or less accurate just like a closed bolt it relies on paint, paint/barrel fit, and other factors. The air delivery system has very little to do with the accuracy.

[Jordan]

My Mini was deadly with the right paint. I miss it tbh, never should have sold it but the lack of repair parts like solenoids worried me and I got rid of it.

I honestly think it's all about paint. Bolt systems have very little bearing on accuracy.