Am i seeing the issues people talked about the ULT trigger kit?

[timetopat]

I have been experimenting with my RT on/off and the ULT trigger kit on off and the light pull and the o-ring placement is nice ( i think lukes customs makes an on off with similar o-ring placement), but i have recently noticed something. Sometimes paint breaks but only in the latter part of the barrel. Like it seems like occasionally a ball will almost hit another ball in the barrel and cause a break. I take off the barrel and look at the inside and the breakage is not on the bolt or even in the back half of the two piece barrel. It doesnt seem like the bolt severed the ball or it blew up on the bolt. I have seen some people say the ULT is kind of finicky and while cool can "short stroke". I am familiar with that with autocockers but not with mags. Is it the same principal and that might be what is causing what i am seeing where one ball launches fine but the second might actually not go fast enough and a third hits it? I tried a gamma core marker with the same paint and no issues.

Thanks

[nak81783]

It’s possible to get a squib shot, but you’d probably feel the marker chuff, which is a partial/weak shot.

1. With the marker aired up, pull the trigger very slowly. Use a finger behind the trigger to put some counter weight against the pull, to help control the slow pull better. Shoot it this way a dozen times or so. Does it ever chuff or shoot more than once after the initial shot? If so take out a ULT shim or two.

2. Air the marker up, shoot, and hold the trigger back for a while. Does it eventually chuff or shoot again? If so, take out a ULT shim or two and/or change the top on/off oring.

But yeah, for no fuss, just use the RT on/off.

[timetopat]

Thanks I appreciate the response! I was fiddling with the automag and when I aired it up with the ult kit I noticed it shot as soon as I turned the air on with my asa. I’ll have to look at those shims . I noticed occasionally it seems to almost try a second shot sometimes. I might end up going back to my rt on/off but I’ll see with the shims. The trigger pull is cool but it is finicky it seems

[k_obeastly]

Firing when applying air can be normal and not an issue regardless of the on/off used. Just hold the trigger when airing up.

[timetopat]

Thanks i had no idea. Ill have to try that next time.

[Olsson]

Before you go any further, rule out a malfunction that is quite a bit easier to detect first.

Do you use a force feed hopper? If so, it may very well be that the second ball in the stack gets hit by the bolt when you fire, due to the minuscule paint of today. Thusly, the second ball in the stack gets weakened enough so that it breaks in the barrel without any following ball hitting it. I have seen this with soooo many different markers where the owners are scratching their heads in bewilderment as to what could be wrong.

So, if you do use a force feed hopper, do yourself a favor and switch to a non force feed one and see what happens. As an added bonus, if your Automag does chuff with your non force feed marker, but no ball breaks in the barrel - then you have an even greater reason to assume the malfunction was due to small paint.

[nak81783]

AGD figured out ball stack clipping decades ago. I’ve used all kinds of Automags for decades with Halos and Rotors without issue. Of course, there is a limit. If the paint is really small, most/all markers will struggle, increasingly so as the paint gets more brittle.

I’d have Rotors jam from small paint before my Automags would have ball stack clipping issues.

[Olsson]

Interesting, I didn't know that AGD had that figured out already. Thank you for pointing that out to me. I will most definitely try out force feed hoppers even on my mech Automags now, and hopefully not notice any issues with breaks in the barrel.

timetopat - take notice. My advice might not be as sound as I initially thought.

[timetopat]

Thanks for the information both of you. I am using a spire hopper. I will need to run some tests and run some paintballs through the gun. If the rt on/off is fine it might just be that i need to tinker more with the ULT kit.

[Drcemento]

I think it's also possible it has to do with your barrel and detent system. what are you using for that? I've seen the end of the barrel break with my mags as well. I had a BOA barrel with the BW 3d printed detent - it was to tight a fit in the BOA, and I was getting breaks that started midway down the barrel. a little careful trimming to allow for more movent seemed to stop the issue. the OG wire detents are terrible.

[timetopat]

Hmm, never thought of that. I have a ULE body with one of those angel detent that appears to use some kind of sprint or something and not a nubbin. Could the detent like this need replacing? I havnt replaced it yet and its been there for a while (i got the body with the detent already on it).

[nak81783]

An oring is typically needed between the body and the detent for proper spacing and to keep it from unthreading. As long as they’re kept clean and free of corrosion/rust, they’ll last a very long time.

I believe as long as the tip of the detent ball can travel flush with the inner diameter of the marker body, and there are no witness marks on the detent body (the end the detent ball sticks out of), it’s likely OK.