Gen E/DM3 Matrix resource

[lew]

With Bones Jackson's legendary Matrix information trove MIA and him unwilling to do anything about it, is there another resource out there? Mainly looking for an o-ring and troubleshooting guide.

[gabe]

I hassled them about it earlier this year but it sounds like they are working on bringing that resource back.

Either way, one of the members on here should be able to help. I have some limited information, what exactly are you looking for or what symptoms is your Matrix exhibiting?

[Tracker]

latches has the info, it was sent to him by bones, hes planning on rehosting it, but i dont know where hes at in the process

i helped write the damn thing..

ask your question, it might get answered

[lew]

I'm just in the preliminary stage. A DM3 should be in the mailbox when I go to pick it up this afternoon. It should be in operating condition, but I'm the kind of nut that likes having technical info on-hand before there is a problem. I had one years ago and it was a great shooter, but any specific details are lost to my pudding brain.

The most pressing matter would be the o-ring list. If it doesn't need a rebuild soon, it will eventually. I have an o-ring master case and a bunch of other rebuild kits for other markers, so I already have any size I'll need.

Since I like spare parts, anyone know where to find a solenoid?

Good news on Bones' resource.

Thanks, folks!

[Tracker]

solenoid will be hard to come by i think, SMC stopped supplying that noid years ago that im aware of. facebook groups would be a good place to ask,

finding the orings is a google problem, not trying to rude about that but seriously, i know for a fact on ZDSPB he has CAD renderings of the bolt systems of multiple markers..
when i googled DM3 o-ring list, the very first link is to zdspb's o-ring info page, and if you scroll down and click the DM3 bolt link this pops up

[gabe]

Do be aware that older Gen-E guns used X-rings on the tophat so you may have to source those. O-rings can work just fine as well in those locations.

[lew]

solenoid will be hard to come by i think, SMC stopped supplying that noid years ago that im aware of. facebook groups would be a good place to ask,

finding the orings is a google problem, not trying to rude about that but seriously, i know for a fact on ZDSPB he has CAD renderings of the bolt systems of multiple markers..
when i googled DM3 o-ring list, the very first link is to zdspb's o-ring info page, and if you scroll down and click the DM3 bolt link this pops up

I dug deeper into my tech info stash and found that image. I knew I mined his site for anything I could possibly find useful.

Is there any easy way to tell if it's a Gen E or a DM3? The seller (thanks freedom!) described it as a DM3, but I can't remember the distinguishing features of the verified DM3 I had years ago. This one is gloss red with an LCD display. Serial number is in the 23,xxx range. The matching barrel is has a Generation Sports Matrix jewel sticker. There are no eyes, and the grip frame doesn't have the milling on either side above the trigger area.

Gabe: Noted, and thank you.

[gabe]

With the branded Generation Sports barrel it's probably a Gen-E, a very late one. Later model LCD guns used the Image bolt kit which is very similar/the same as the DM3 bolt kit. The LED board guns used the earlier bolt kit with X-rings and the whole bolt kit was shorter by about 1/8".

[lew]

Good to know. I'm not complaining as it looks gorgeous and all seems well.

Also, there's a link to the DYE manual on PBN's Vintage Matrix section, for those that need it.

[lew]

So DYE's manual is great for the mechanics and leak troubleshooting, but it's not terribly helpful for either board type. As for this Gen E board, navigating it is easy, but I have some questions:

1) I can turn the buzzer and vibration features off, as well as change the timer. Does the timer run all the time?

2) How do I adjust the ROF? Getting to that menu setting is easy enough, but holding any of the buttons results in either nothing or it sets the ROF to 0.0. Trying to change it, I enter that menu option, and "HOLD!" flashes and then disappears after a few seconds and nothing happens. This occurs with either of the two lower buttons.

3) Is there a board reset button, and does the solenoid have a test button? (I have not yet done a deep dive into the internals.)

[gabe]

You should be able to turn the buzzer off and change the timer to 0 all though the menus. The timer does run all the time after the first trigger pull in live mode.

As far as the ROF, those counters are for the current ROF and maximum ROF. They do not determine ROF cap. The board does not have an ROF cap as it was made during the time when all boards were semi only and uncapped. To make an ROF cap you have to do some maths and set the ball in place delay to some absurdly long number, mine will go up to 100ms bip delay but after turning off and back on it will only save up to a 35ms bip delay. With 20ms of dwell and 80ms bip delay that is 10bps. I let it go at 20ms dwell and 35ms bip and that runs around 12 or 12.5 bps cap.

I should mention that yes, there is an "unlock" button that you have to access under the left grip panel that you have to press to adjust the dwell and other parameters. You will see a little lock symbol on the screen and after pressing the button it will "unlock". It's just a little button forward and above the screen behind the microswitch area.

[lew]

Gabe, your insight has put my mind at ease, and I thank you heartily for that.

So, the ROF just tells you how fast you can move your digits. I got up to 12 bps, which is more than enough for me. I usually shoot with only my index finger, though.

I ordered another board because I like spare parts, but it seems like this one is good-to-go. I threw a spare manifold Max Flo and a CP gas-thru on, so I just need to air it up and set the regs.

[gabe]

Glad to be of help! I really love the Matrix/DM platform and its simplicity

When you set the regs make sure to start really low on the HPR and just turn it up to maybe 100psi then turn the LPR up until the bolt snaps back into place (if starting with the bolt forward which I would recommend). After that slowly work the LPR and HPR up until you see about 280fps. Start gradually increasing the LPR pressure until you see the fps top out and stabilize to around +/- 5 to 7 fps. That sets the LPR pressure. Then work the HPR up to field velocity if you're still low. The dwell I like to run 20ms which is super high but it allows for very low LPR pressure and bolt speed which makes this gun great later in the season when it gets cold and paint is super brittle. For best efficiency a dwell of around 12-15ms is the norm.

[Tracker]

DM3 vs genE is easy

DM3 has teardrops milled into the frame above the trigger guard, and the "scoops" on the side are milled back to the 9 volt area vs about mid way, and of course guaranteed eyes from the factory.

everything is interchangeable dont be surprised if you get some mix and match.. mine is a gen E body with a DM3 frame..

[gabe]

Not sure about everything being interchangeable. I had an early-ish Gen-E matrix LED at the same time as a DM3 and tried to swap things around for fun. I found that the bodies on the Gen-E guns that came with the early bare aluminum bolts are the same length but the front locating circlip for the bolt is further back. When trying to put a LCD/DM3 bolt in it would not seat all the way down and close inspection showed that the early 3-port bolt kit was about 1/8" shorter than the later LCD multi-hole bolt.