Designing a new paintball gun from scratch (aka, school gave me a Solidworks license)

[Fubarius]

A few more steps along the way. Added that second feed mounting hole, I'll whip up a vertical adapter with an Eclipse style stub eventually. Made the feed port First Strike shaped, for more fun later. Added a barrel (ok, downloaded an existing model of a Dye Boomstick, really any barrel will do since if I ever did build this I wouldn't even include a barrel).

And the start of a bolt. As you can see the bolt will fully push the ball into the barrel. This is one of my design must haves. Some of the most scary accurate setups I've shot were on guns that fully seated the ball into the barrel. With excellent paint of course. Could just be snake oil, but it's my design and I can do what I want. Working on a very different hammer/valve system I want to try. Might not be as efficient as I want, but will allow a choke style velocity adjuster at the valve.

[Fubarius]

Latest update. Started work on the valve. My crazy idea is to try and make a single tube Sterling design. So the valve is basically a reversed autococker/spyder whatever valve as found on a stacked tube layout, but instead of the air going up it gets sent through a large hole towards the front of the gun. I will eventually add a choke style velocity adjust screw to the valve, once I figure out where in the body tube it ends up.

[tyronejk]

What will the hammer look like? It'd need a big hole for air to go through but it may still be blown backwards by the air burst.

[Fubarius]

The hammer wouldn't be traditional. It doesn't have to be round you see, just heavy enough and with a spring pushing it. So I'm envisioning a sort of heavy firing pin instead of a hammer.

[Fubarius]

Power tube finished for now, big old firing pin thingy started. Main spring may end up in the top of the grip frame.

[Fubarius]

No update on the model yet, but I was pondering a few things. I could flatten the angle on the top of the firing pin and matching angle on the bottom of the powertube, and that would give me a place for a main spring. But that won't work. For one, the pump stroke would be really, really odd. Assume I have a sear of some kind for the bolt to catch firing pin, and a spring between the powertube and firing pin (give me a little slack, I just figured out how to model a spring like yesterday, they don't come up often in cabinetry), as you pump back you'd have zero resistance, which is good. But when the bolt catches the pin and you pump forward you'd get all the tension from the main spring, increasing the farther you push the pump handle. This would feel weird. And nothing to hold the bolt closed when it gets fully forward. You'd end up firing the gun, with bolt open, if you let go of the pump handle. Unless you add a second sear to lock the bolt forward.

Nah, that's getting too complicated.

On another tangent, I'm not 100% happy with the powertube. It's design is ok, I'm just wondering if I get get rid of it entirely. The top back half of it could be integrated into the valve body, and the front bottom half could be part of the bolt. The middle would be like two half cylinders overlapping. I may save a version 2 to tinker with that idea.

[Jackson]

You said it yourself already that it's a single tube sterling type, so why not have the same kind of sear arrangement? Pump back compresses the spring and latches to the hammer, forward stroke pulls it all forward.

[Fubarius]

Oh, that was the intention from the beginning, but one of the main reasons I'm doing this is to experiment with different ways of doing things. I saw a spot were a spring "could" go and wondered what would happen and decided to share my thoughts.

There will probably be a lot of dead ends on this project.

[Fubarius]

Ok, just had to get the idea out of my head (speaking of probable dead ends from last comment). No more power tube, just really long overlapping valve body and bolt....



Not sure I'm happy with that zigzaggy air route. And that's a lot of surface to be sliding against each other. Tolerances would have to be loose enough to not bind, but tight enough that the air blast won't leak all over and come out the grip frame.

Also, from an ease of manufacturing stand point, I went from two easy parts and one slightly more complex part (I think), to two complex parts. Not sure if I'm saving anything here.

[tyronejk]

I think that zigzaggy air route will restrict flow enough to really choke down your velocity.

Flow through a pipe decreases proportionally with length and increases with the 4th power of radius. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hagen%...uille_equation

[Fubarius]

I did have to shrink down the radius of the pathway quite a bit compared to the Version 1 design so I tend to agree. Not sure how big of an effect it would have though, considering how small a diameter many old pumps had on their powertubes.

Now there is a different school of thought though. A paintball gun doesn't use a continuous flow to launch the ball, but a quick burst that then expands through the system. Too big of pathways and the burst will lose energy as it expands.

I think solidworks can do some airflow simulations, but that's WAY beyond my intro class knowledge.

[markdem]

Oooooh i like this! Super funky design!

[Joshma360]

Hey bro just wanted to reach out after seeing your name on this forum, people said you might be the person to ask for any tips or tricks on how I could get a paintball marker here in the Aus!


For some reason it won’t let me reply back to you on DM’s bro pls get let me know if you have an other socials to talk easier

[markdem]

Joshma360 markdeme@hotmail.com.

I moved to USA 10 years ago so im not up to date on the legal stuff, but in QLD, a paintball gun fell into the subcategory of air rifles.

Head over to the police station and ask them for the paperwork for a firearms licence. You might also wanna double check with a local paintball field to make sure youre applying for the right stuff. In QLD, you would first apply for a category "A" firearms licence (rimfire rifles and air rifles) then apply for category "PB" (paintball). All up this may cost about $500ish? But i did this in 2005 so i would assume it costs more now

Youll need a safe to store the gun (police may or may not come to your house and check this). Most paintball guns are pretty small once you take the tank and barrel off so you could probably get smaller, cheaper safe, but it still has to be "immovable" (bolted to the wall\floor)

Once you got all that squared away, you can head back to the police station and ask for a "permit to aquire". Theyll mail it out to you in about a month. Take the permit to your gun shop and collect your gun.

Congrats! You now own a paintball gun that the local field wont let you use... Seriously, check this first. You may have to travel to special events at certain fields to use your own guns

you probably wont find much old collectable stuff in australia, but if you do, itll probably be really unique. One of the few perks of living in australia is having access to Sterlings

[markdem]

Joshma360 or find me on facebook. Mark de Meillon

[Ecapnation]

Just observationally you have too many turns in your airpath you're going to have restriction issues and flow problems.

Also instead of trying to cram everything into the body why not use a modified feed block as an air transfer pathway as well

[Fubarius]

Just observationally you have too many turns in your airpath you're going to have restriction issues and flow problems.

Also instead of trying to cram everything into the body why not use a modified feed block as an air transfer pathway as well

Yeah, that design got a little out of hand. But in the spirit of education and inspiration for others I feel the need to show the failures on this little side project as well as the successes. I have one more idea to clean that up that might work, but we'll see when I get around to modeling it.

As for an external path, that is a good idea with some real potential. But doing it on the top would mean potentially losing my Phantom feed compatibility. Not willing to do that yet.

But an add on air path on the Side of the body, that could work, and be a place to add some decretive flair. And a matching one on the other side of the body could be used for air routing from a vertical ASA to the rear valve chamber. I kind of expect the final version will need a regulator, so a standard vertical ASA is one of my design requirements.

[Fubarius]

Ok, we're now up to Version 3, though Version 1 may get revisited, and an external air path model would be yet another, but sticking with original concept....



Simple press fit (and tack welded? Epoxied? Added set screw? Oh! Velocity choke screw holding it in place!) air transfer tube, going straight to the bolt. The bolt is now longer to have a fully surrounded firing pin, so no binding on lower tube on the forward stroke. The spring would be something like a Tippmann main spring in size.

I really need to get a grip frame model started on this thing. With a firing pin design the sear is attached to the bolt. This tends to push the trigger forward, or necessitate the need for a sliding trigger. But that could be cool too.

As a bonus, the whole mess got about 3/4" shorter.

[Siress]

if you make that a balanced poppet valve, I think you're onto something

[Fubarius]

Balanced poppet compatibility was something I wanted to include, I'd have to research their design a bit more to decided if its something to include in the base model, or if it's something to open source and let an existing expert at it make an aftermarket.

But something like a Neo Powervalve super simple balance (loooong cup seal going to the back of the valve chamber) would be easy enough.

[Trbo323]

Why not just flow through that center pin? Why the double dog leg to go around it?

Sent from my motorola edge 2024 using Tapatalk

[markdem]

I see this project as more of a "creative" design rather than practical. Sometimes its fun to imagine what could be and ignore practical manufacturing techniques

[Fubarius]

If air went through the striker, it would also have to got through the valve pin. At which point I've reinvented the Trracer.

I'm trying to get away from the traditional Nelson style powertube. I find it's design limiting.

[Tarsun2]

neo power valve and balanced valve; two terms i haven't heard in awhile. (for some reason i have a Spyder Vs2 balanced valve on my desk at work.) let me know if you need pictures lol.
and for the NPV, i ran one of those on my old grey body non-compact spyder. Im pretty sure i still have it too.

[cockerpunk]

the cad work to design a new paintball gun isnt the hard part about designing a new paintball gun.

so id decide if you want to learn solid works, or design a new paintball gun.

[Fubarius]

Oh the CAD certainly isn't needed, heck I basically developed a semi popular antichop ram mod for a BKO on a post-it note. (and it worked too, until ICD lowered the dwell on their stock boards with out telling anyone) But it sure does help convey ideas, work out geometry, and general visualization. Sometimes the idea in your head doesn't quite fit into reality.

This is just a for fun side exercise to clear my mind of all the flanges, mounting plates, drill gauges, and other mundane solids I have to model in class. And all the sheet stock cabinet parts I have to deal with at work.

And there are plenty of people who "think" they can design a new gun, but far too few of them bother to get anything on paper or share it for peer review.

[Fubarius]

Ok, brief up update. Things have been busy this last week, with work, school, and life to haven't had much time to tinker with the model. But I realized I failed to list all my design criteria.

For my idea single tube pump design...

1: Autococker barrel threads. For obvious reason.
2: Bore drop design.
3: Bolt fully pushes ball into barrel.
3: Easy velocity adjustment. A single screw to turn would be nice. Though this could be done by just having a regulator on it. Speaking of...
4: Vertical ASA.
5: If grip frame is fully made standard bottom line accessory mount, a pair of 10-32 screw holes 0.75" apart.
6: If grip frame is fully made standard .45 grip panel compatible, OR, AR style grip lug like a Phantom. I'll probably go the second route. If I ever get it made I got a nice CCM 86 grip block I can put on it.
7: Compatible with existing feed neck option. Already going Phantom compatible here.

Oops, forgot a few. Will also add more as I come up with them.

8: Design for ease of manufacturing. No swoopy milling, no body needing a 5-axis milling machine. I small shop with a turret lathe and a bridgeport clone should be able to make this.
9: No traditional Nelson style powertube or valve. Always felt a little wrong to me. Plus makes it more of a challenge than just designing a custom bore drop, cocker threaded, Phantom body and bolt.
10: Undercocking pump handle. I'm designing this thing to use people's collections of nice shiny aftermarket barrels, I don't want them getting scratched up. Could still use a pair of side pump arms, see the old SP Boss pump.

[markdem]

You can pick up an old lathe for around $500. I got mine for $1000 with all sorts of accessories. Many are small enough to keep in a garden shed or even in the back of a car

But if youre not ready to fabricate, i think you should let your imagination run wild and not worry about machining difficulties

[Siress]

It's also easier than ever for individuals to have custom parts made. Protolabs, Xometry, and the like make it very easy and reasonably priced.