Mini GS frame on Automag - expanded notes
First off, shout out to YeOldeSliggity who brought both the idea and original post.
I'm posting here with his permission so as to get it in the AGD section and spell out the process a bit more.
----------------------------------------------------
HOW TO INSTALL AN EMPIRE MINI GS ON AN AUTOMAG
PREAMBLE::
This is a pretty easy frame swap from a modification perspective - a competent garage/DIY modder is plenty capable. Is it better than an AGD spec frame? No! AT BEST it does the same thing.... Non-AGD frame swaps notoriously suffer from finicky firing from sear geometry, poor fitment or sear engagement issues. Do it for fun, aesthetics and trying something different but it's not an "upgrade".
Ingredients:
• Donor Mini GS.
• Automag recipient. Any can work - if it'll take an AGD frame, it'll take this.
• An Eclipse T-rail ASA or similar
• Drill press, or a drill and steady hand and metal bits in common sizes
• Something to radius cut so the field strip screw lays flat (read on)
• A longer grub screw to sit in the GS's vertical trigger stop adjustment so that it'll reach, if your rail has empty space above that area.
NICE TO HAVE >>>>>
• extra trigger rod (the hardened rod that threads into sear hinge, 4/40 threads) as you'll be cutting this shorter
• I suspect I'll wind up messing with on/off pin sizes, TBD
STEP 1: Strip the mini GS down to frame
Below is all we need from the GS, other than grips.
I was able to sell the rest off and offset much of my purchase cost - the ASA's are in demand for original MINI retrofit.
STEP 2: Open up the GS frame holes to accommodate AGD frame screw and rail bushing
The Mini GS screw holes are a match for AGD rail at 105MM spacing!
• The GS front screw hole will need to be opened slightly (3/16?) to accept a slightly larger screw for AGD body
• The GS rear screw hole will need to be opened up as well - if you're retaining the copper rail bushing it'll need to be a bit larger (1/4?)
Don't quote my drill bit sizes but I think those were right. Any sizeable bit set should have what you need. Take your time on this step - a loose frame fit can cause more problems than you might think for automag firing.
STEP 3: Radius cut the underside of GS rear screw frame to flatten, so as to accommodate field strip screw
This part is optional depending on your approach but is recommended - the field strip screw is designed to retain the valve and hardened to not to shear off inside from firing pressure.
I laid my frame flat and hogged it out a bit with a large wood boring bit (aluminum is fairly soft after all) Not work I'd brag about but it's passable.
Here you see "before" and "after"
STEP 4: Fit an ASA
Mini GS is T-slotted and accepts Eclipse ASAs! It is however not a full-through slot. The simple solution if that bothers you is to cut 1/4 of t-rail off the back of your ASA. Optional, but nice for alignment. Here's the ASA before I cut the back for better fit.
STEP 5: Install longer grub screw into the upper/vertical trigger stop if required by your automag rail
My ULE rail is milled where the trigger stop would go, so I had to put a relatively long grub screw in place of the stocker. not all AGD frames are pocketed in that area so YMMV. Test fit with the sear lug out of the way and see if you can set the forward travel on trigger -- you'll see what I mean. Sorry I can't confirm grub size, i stole one from DYE parts bin.
STEP 6: Shorten the sear lug
This is a critical step and, the one that will take the most time and patience. The sear lug is too long to fit and will need to be shortened or replaced. It's 4-40 threaded.
• First, thread the sear lug all the way in so you can extend it later if you cut a bit too much
• Next, you'll need to take some off the end. I want to say I took ~8MM but I'm afraid I lost that note.... suffice to say you can cut more but not put it back on
Plan to try, check fitment, cut again, and recheck a few times. Ideally with firing cycles.
The end goal here is for your sear lug to sit within the recessed back pocket of the trigger. It's conveniently well suited to "capture" the sear lug. the geometry is "OK" not ideal --- the sear lug is about 15º off parallel to frame without any further modification. It'll work --- but the angle and sear length very likely could need fiddling to get steady performance.
STEP 6: Final assembly
Get it assembled and get the GS trigger adjusted to suit, if you didn't in step6.
Here's my tester as she sits --- works, needs a bit of dialing as I'm getting bounce / "RT like" effect. Also Sliggity's in yellow
You may have noticed my cuts weren't showing bare aluminum --- I use a blackener, "chemical anodizing" more commonly seen in the 2A crowd. It's neat stuff but TOXIC. Do not take it lightly and use PPE if you try it.
Happy to update post with any findings/updates.
Any high-IQ questions are best asked to the full group, I am just a layman.
Go do work and happy shooting!
OTHER PONDERINGS
♦♦♦ IS THIS REVERSIBLE?
Yes, the Mini GS frame can be put back into stock service. The only drawback is the frame mount holes are now enlarged a bit, which is annoying but not a show-stopper issue.
♦♦♦ WILL AN OG MINI FRAME FIT?
Anecdotally sounds like yes, BUT the ASA is funky mounting and will need a solution. Also not sure if the mini trigger is pocketed, which is important.
♦♦♦ CAN I USE THE GS ASA?
Maybe? The silver asa port containing the filter is a full pressure outlet. it'd need adapting. it's the same thread as a tank regulator burst disc FYI.
♦♦♦ CAN I MAKE THIS ELECTRO?
Anything is possible, but it won't be easy. go nuts
♦♦♦ CAN I MAKE THIS PNEUMATIC?
Now that's more compelling - but I'm not smart enough to guide you. It'd be wicked cool if someone could utilize the GS ASA's high pressure port for air, and the low pressure airtube vertical outlet to supply pneumatics. Along with solving mounting, it'd require modification to ASA to go low enough to service the pneumatics --- this ASA won't go that low out the box.
I'm posting here with his permission so as to get it in the AGD section and spell out the process a bit more.
----------------------------------------------------
HOW TO INSTALL AN EMPIRE MINI GS ON AN AUTOMAG
PREAMBLE::
This is a pretty easy frame swap from a modification perspective - a competent garage/DIY modder is plenty capable. Is it better than an AGD spec frame? No! AT BEST it does the same thing.... Non-AGD frame swaps notoriously suffer from finicky firing from sear geometry, poor fitment or sear engagement issues. Do it for fun, aesthetics and trying something different but it's not an "upgrade".
Ingredients:
• Donor Mini GS.
• Automag recipient. Any can work - if it'll take an AGD frame, it'll take this.
• An Eclipse T-rail ASA or similar
• Drill press, or a drill and steady hand and metal bits in common sizes
• Something to radius cut so the field strip screw lays flat (read on)
• A longer grub screw to sit in the GS's vertical trigger stop adjustment so that it'll reach, if your rail has empty space above that area.
NICE TO HAVE >>>>>
• extra trigger rod (the hardened rod that threads into sear hinge, 4/40 threads) as you'll be cutting this shorter
• I suspect I'll wind up messing with on/off pin sizes, TBD
STEP 1: Strip the mini GS down to frame
Below is all we need from the GS, other than grips.
I was able to sell the rest off and offset much of my purchase cost - the ASA's are in demand for original MINI retrofit.
STEP 2: Open up the GS frame holes to accommodate AGD frame screw and rail bushing
The Mini GS screw holes are a match for AGD rail at 105MM spacing!
• The GS front screw hole will need to be opened slightly (3/16?) to accept a slightly larger screw for AGD body
• The GS rear screw hole will need to be opened up as well - if you're retaining the copper rail bushing it'll need to be a bit larger (1/4?)
Don't quote my drill bit sizes but I think those were right. Any sizeable bit set should have what you need. Take your time on this step - a loose frame fit can cause more problems than you might think for automag firing.
STEP 3: Radius cut the underside of GS rear screw frame to flatten, so as to accommodate field strip screw
This part is optional depending on your approach but is recommended - the field strip screw is designed to retain the valve and hardened to not to shear off inside from firing pressure.
I laid my frame flat and hogged it out a bit with a large wood boring bit (aluminum is fairly soft after all) Not work I'd brag about but it's passable.
Here you see "before" and "after"
STEP 4: Fit an ASA
Mini GS is T-slotted and accepts Eclipse ASAs! It is however not a full-through slot. The simple solution if that bothers you is to cut 1/4 of t-rail off the back of your ASA. Optional, but nice for alignment. Here's the ASA before I cut the back for better fit.
STEP 5: Install longer grub screw into the upper/vertical trigger stop if required by your automag rail
My ULE rail is milled where the trigger stop would go, so I had to put a relatively long grub screw in place of the stocker. not all AGD frames are pocketed in that area so YMMV. Test fit with the sear lug out of the way and see if you can set the forward travel on trigger -- you'll see what I mean. Sorry I can't confirm grub size, i stole one from DYE parts bin.
STEP 6: Shorten the sear lug
This is a critical step and, the one that will take the most time and patience. The sear lug is too long to fit and will need to be shortened or replaced. It's 4-40 threaded.
• First, thread the sear lug all the way in so you can extend it later if you cut a bit too much
• Next, you'll need to take some off the end. I want to say I took ~8MM but I'm afraid I lost that note.... suffice to say you can cut more but not put it back on
Plan to try, check fitment, cut again, and recheck a few times. Ideally with firing cycles.
The end goal here is for your sear lug to sit within the recessed back pocket of the trigger. It's conveniently well suited to "capture" the sear lug. the geometry is "OK" not ideal --- the sear lug is about 15º off parallel to frame without any further modification. It'll work --- but the angle and sear length very likely could need fiddling to get steady performance.
STEP 6: Final assembly
Get it assembled and get the GS trigger adjusted to suit, if you didn't in step6.
Here's my tester as she sits --- works, needs a bit of dialing as I'm getting bounce / "RT like" effect. Also Sliggity's in yellow
You may have noticed my cuts weren't showing bare aluminum --- I use a blackener, "chemical anodizing" more commonly seen in the 2A crowd. It's neat stuff but TOXIC. Do not take it lightly and use PPE if you try it.
Happy to update post with any findings/updates.
Any high-IQ questions are best asked to the full group, I am just a layman.
Go do work and happy shooting!
OTHER PONDERINGS
♦♦♦ IS THIS REVERSIBLE?
Yes, the Mini GS frame can be put back into stock service. The only drawback is the frame mount holes are now enlarged a bit, which is annoying but not a show-stopper issue.
♦♦♦ WILL AN OG MINI FRAME FIT?
Anecdotally sounds like yes, BUT the ASA is funky mounting and will need a solution. Also not sure if the mini trigger is pocketed, which is important.
♦♦♦ CAN I USE THE GS ASA?
Maybe? The silver asa port containing the filter is a full pressure outlet. it'd need adapting. it's the same thread as a tank regulator burst disc FYI.
♦♦♦ CAN I MAKE THIS ELECTRO?
Anything is possible, but it won't be easy. go nuts
♦♦♦ CAN I MAKE THIS PNEUMATIC?
Now that's more compelling - but I'm not smart enough to guide you. It'd be wicked cool if someone could utilize the GS ASA's high pressure port for air, and the low pressure airtube vertical outlet to supply pneumatics. Along with solving mounting, it'd require modification to ASA to go low enough to service the pneumatics --- this ASA won't go that low out the box.
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