Phantom + Grease is a No-No

[Grendel]

I know most members here will know that putting grease in Phantoms is not necessary or even recommended but had to get this off my mind. I just tore down a used phantom last night that was externally pretty clean looking but not pumping very smoothly. When I started tearing it down I found copious amounts of white[ish] grease (DOW 33?] packed into the trigger frame the valve train and the pump arm slot. It was packed in there like it had a Zerk fitting and a grease gun was used. When I finally got every thing apart there was a lot of grease, loads for grit and fair amount of rust (hammer, pump arm and spring). All of this was holding "water" (why the rust) and the everything that moves or has things moving against it had a fair amount of wear. Phantoms do not use grease, in fact for most any pump marker a very little [emphasis on very little] amount of synthetic air tool oil is all it needs and is meant to have for proper use. For the love of God only use grease on markers that call for grease and even then it is supposed to be a light coating not pumped in and fill every crevice.

Why you do not use grease on a Phantom:

1. Not designed for it, does not need it (really that simple)
2. Like most Nelson based markers the valve train is subject to getting foreign material in it (Phantoms are better the most at keeping it out but it still gets in there) and when you use grease especially a lot of it, it just collects this foreign material and turns it into lapping compound and causes excessive wear. Just the opposite of your goal when adding grease.
3. If you overload the grease it traps moisture and contrary to common believed even Stainless Steel with corrode and god forbid it is touching any carbon steal (roll pins, other hardware, sear...etc.). Once you get corrosion on stainless it will keep corroding in that spot almost no matter what you do from now on.
4. Add in not keeping your stuff clean after use and doing an occasional breakdown this grease just holds the moisture, grit, and corrosion byproducts against your parts. This causes conductive material in an aqueous solution then any minor electrical charge (even static electricity) and now you have galvanic corrosion which can cause serious erosion of base metals.

So now I am in the process of pulling all of the parts out of the hammer and valve, and the trigger frame to get rid of the rust (corrosion) and potentially replacing roll pins. Might end up having to truly polish the hammer and sear (bolt was able to clean up with some Scotch Brite in a couple areas) which is something I do not like to do too much risk of polishing through the plating.

If you intend on using grease on a Phantom please apply it "correctly" with only a very light coat but I would prefer you just stick to air tool oil (synthetic). Regardless keep your equipment reasonably clean and maintained. Not asking you to break it down every time you use it but keep it wiped off and dry before you put it away. If you take a roll in the dirt or you marker gets shot up terribly that might be a good time to tear it down give it a good cleaning and sparingly lubricate the moving parts and at a minimum at least give it a good tear down before you put it up at the end of the season or before you add it to you vanity wall and leave it hanging there.

<climbs down off soap box>

P.S. oh and by the way adding a little air tool oil to the ASA occasionally is a good way to get a little lubricant to power tube, cup seal and valve spring on a Phantom. When I tore that down on this marker thankfully there wasn't any grease but the whole valve assembly was dry (seal shrank) and looks like it has never seen oil since it was assembled.

[Chuck E Ducky]

The springs rust and pit the stainless. Jewelers rouge, and a buffing wheel will clean everything up quickly. Might not look as good as new, but it will shoot good as new.

You can get cheap kits from Harbor Freight. I had one phantom sent to me it looked like it was sitting in a bucket of water for years on the inside. Internals looked like hell but it got 42+ shots to a 12g after polishing them up I even reused the springs I cleaned them up with a wire wheel then polished the outside with the buffing wheel for a bit.

The protective coating on these internals were long gone due to abuse. I polished them up to a mirror finish you could still see some pitting but they were lows so it don’t effect anything. Anyway marker shot amazing. Cup seal still looked good so I just flipped it. Thing shot Phenomenal.

[Grendel]

Yup, hoping the jeweler's rouge is not needed right now all of the parts are sitting in Evap-o-Rust so later I will finish disassembly and see what I have. To top everything else off a previous owner must have had a "pump binding issue" and milled out the channel in the frame to the point it cut into the front frame mount hole Now I get to figure out if I can "fix" this. I expect they just did not know how to adjust the pump arm nor knew you can add brass shims (.22 lr casing). Only good thing is it actually looks like they actually used a mill to remove the material so I am thinking about filling the void with a brass insert and re-milling the channel for the pump arm then re-drill the frame hole for the mounting bolt.

[Chuck E Ducky]

What if you just made a fatter pump arm and took the material off needed at the bolt contact point. You could always just tap the handle hole larger. I found some nice brass cocking rod material at Lowe’s maybe you can find something that fits the existing frame. Or maybe see if you can find some Delrin rod you can mock up some shims to fill that area get it back in spec. I be it would smooth out the pump stroke if you add a some sort of sleeve. Or make a longer fatter version of the 22 shell mod.

[Grendel]

Thought about cleaning it up masking off and use some metal reinforced 2 part epoxy then re-drill (no threads this is the frame). I was just brainstorming about using brass and custom make it to take the place of using a brass pump arm shim. The more I think about it the epoxy method might be the better idea for both strength and easy. that actually milled out the channel all the way through the frame plate and cut away a small portion of the hole for the front frame screw. Little concerned about the strength in the long run and want to fix it before it becomes a problem. Even contemplating through drilling from the side and adding a couple of small pins and green Loctite them in place.

[JeeperCreeper]

Wait, you're supposed to do maintenance on Phantoms?

[Grendel]

Yes, they do require a little care, not a lot but a little. Use them hard just don't put them up wet and dirty, and use light oiling.

[Grendel]

Oh and here are some images of the milling work done on the Trigger Frame at the pump slot that I need to figure out how to fix without damaging the rest of the anodization:

[Chuck E Ducky]

So I just picked up some of this for an oops I did the other day changing my battery on my NSX. While installing my battery the wrench slipped wedged itself between the positive and my AC return line. It’s aluminum brazing rod. All you need is to get the material to about 750* with a propane/Map torch and it flows like water when you touch it to aluminum no flux needed.

You could easily fill that with this. It won’t Ano tho

[Grendel]

I actually have some aluminum soldering (brazing) rod already but this is the Silver/Back acid wash Phantom I just got and worried if I heat it up enough to melt the rod that it will damage the existing anodization then I am screwed trying to get it redone and match. As you said these rods joints are not anodizeable.

[Chuck E Ducky]

Jb weld a brass shim in then notch the top so I the rods removable. It will ride on the brass. Probably your easiest solution.

[Grendel]

I think that is basically the route I am going to go. I'll use some thin wall brass tubing I have that is the right diameter for a typical pump arm shim and cast it in place. Thankfully I just bought Epoxy masking and casting wax so I can use the actual pump arm, shim stock and assemble the frame to the body as part of the mold the fill the gap from the end. I think I will just fill the front bolt hole as well then just re-drill it. I found a couple of aluminum filled epoxies so just need to make a decision there. I can always open up the top of the pump shim once the repair is fully cured just enough to get the pump arm out.