Vee Twin Autococker

[Chuck E Ducky]

So cool watching it all come together.

[Nuppydog]

Ooh yeah! I see mine in that bunch. Looking forward to it!

[DocsMachine]

Makin' a 'Cocker bolt pin, live and in color!

(Well, part of it, anyway. )



Doc.

[Siress]

Curious as to why you didn't part the pin off in the same op.

[DocsMachine]

Curious as to why you didn't part the pin off in the same op.

-Inexperience.

No, really. The pin gets pretty small, and if I'm not very careful, can chatter or distort if I try to cut too much. Clearly, it can be done, as everybody makes pins like this, successfully. For the moment, I opted to turn these in stages, keeping as much support as I can for it.

Once I have a better handle on speeds and feeds- I'm still very new to this whole CNC thing- yeah, the "right" way will be to turn the shank, including the detent groove, then most of the head, part off, and then have a bar feeder or bar puller (which I have but have not yet used) advance the bar the right amount, and then cut another one.Lather, rinse, repeat until the bar runs out.

Still working up to that.

Doc.

[XEMON]

What about having a part support/tail support comes in when you need it?
Do you have a second CNC holder in there?

[DocsMachine]

[/quoWhat about having a part support/tail support comes in when you need it?
Do you have a second CNC holder in there

-Well, the part itself precludes a tailstock, which requires a small hole to be drilled in the end of the part. And, the Omniturn lathe I have, doesn't have a tailstock anyway.

As for a "second CNC holder", there are machines that have a second chuck, facing the first. And can use it to grab the machined end of a piece, so that the other end can be done.

A cheap used one that fancy would probably start at $80K, and besides the expense, would be FAR too physically large and heavy to fit into my glorified 2-car garage.

No, I'll get this sorted out, as I said I'm still quite new to the actual mechanics of using CNC, and it'll just take a little time, practice and experience.

Doc.

[XEMON]

I can only imagine jumping into this size/level of CNC ...
As a garage hobbyist it took me 4-5 years to figure out how to use my Emco compact 5 CNC (and I have not touched the automated tool changer yet ...)

Keep up the work and keep trying and make program from scratch ... It only gets easier and faster 😁

[DocsMachine]

Et voilá!



The upper left one is a stock Inception 11/16" valve, the other is the first of my shiny new Vee-Twin valves!



The only drawback? It's awful tricky to accurately drill those holes. I spent a good deal of time to make myself a fixture to help in that, but to use it, it takes nearly as long as if I just set each one up by hand.

I need to spend a moment and redesign and remake the fixture- it's worth the time in order to do these things right. It's literally the heart of the gun.

Doc.

[DocsMachine]

Aaand... Done!



Well, the first four, anyway, and technically at least two of those include pump kits which I still have to make- I have emails out to you fellows, except Woooulf, whose email I can't seem to find. You, sir, wanted a pump kit; the "default", if you can call it that, is a typical WGP-era Sniper-2 kit. If you want something fancier, send me a pic or two and I can see what I can do.

Mark and 'Nuppy', yours I'll finish up as soon as I get these four out the door.

And, just so we're all on the same page: These are supplied sanded smooth, but not polished. Final finishing will be up to your anodizer. I can polish them if you'd like, but that's a good bit of extra work, and there'd be an additional charge.

The bolts are supplied full-size- that is, they're not "wasp waisted" in the middle. The weight savings would be negligible (and you're not putting together a double-barrel to have a light, fast speedball gun ) and the drag is actually less with the full bolt.

The ports are also what I've come to call "uniform"- the port passages are the same size bore all the way from the valve to the face of the ball. All too many people want Gigantic Ports™ thinking that bigger holes equal more flow. That's not the case, and in paintball, never has been the case. You want to let the gas charge expand as little as possible before it reaches the ball, so that it saves as much energy as possible, in that charge.

Compressed air holds energy because it's compressed. Release some of that compression before it can do any work (that is, move the ball) and that energy is wasted.

The bolts are unique to the Vee-Twins; the only other bolts you can use are the "venturi" style where the "port" of the bolt is an open ring all the way around. I can mill down or drill out the original bolts if you like, but I suggest trying them stock, first. I have actually done a little experimenting on this kind of thing.

And, of course, being handmade and not polished and annoed, they may not appear quite as well finished as something that fell out of a $100K CNC machining center. I'm also not going to assemble and test each one- I'm fully confident they'll work for you, but if there's some glitch or issue, just let me know. This is not a "fire and forget" thing- I'll do everything I can to help you get the gun up and running to your satisfaction.

Oh, and the default bolt pins are aluminum. Stainless is available by request.

Thank you, and especially thanks all of you for your patience. I can't wait to see some of these up and running!

(Oh, that said, I am going to assemble and test-shoot at least one of these, for next week's video. Just fair warning. )

Doc.

[SETHZILLA!]

I'm hoping one of those is still mine Doc? Please check your email and PM's

[DocsMachine]

I'm hoping one of those is still mine Doc? Please check your email and PM's

-I have your PM's, but did we ever get an email to go through?

PM inbound.

Doc.

[ford]

PM'd you as well Doc, tried emailing you a while ago but never heard back.

[DocsMachine]

And Part Five is up! The longest one yet, and on my slow connection, took forever to upload. Hope you ladies and gents like it!

Doc.

[maggot]

Ha, the dew can mess was great!
Also, I was cringing so bad watching the front blocks chunks get separated by the saw... not that I don't have faith, just dang scary.

[DocsMachine]

Automeisters Vee-Twin kit is done!

He was the one to light off this whole party- and also because he was getting a standard setup - so the first one cleaned, finished and test-fitted goes to him!



Stand by, gents, more on the way!

Doc.

[Siress]

Hol' up. Did you put the pump rod down the center of the body? That's....awesome. Got a video where you machined that feature? edit: Oh, I see...you just casually slipped that crazy feature in Part 2 @2:37 like gun drilling ain't no thing...

[DocsMachine]

Where you been? There's a pic of a complete kit I made back in '05 or so, on the first page of this thread- and the pump kit quite obviously goes down the middle.

I can't say it's "not a thing", as it's very, very easy to get the drills to start "wandering", and the holes not wanting to line up in the center. There's precautions you can take- one of which is only use new or very-low mileage drills- but if the hole starts to really drift, there's not a whole hell of a lot you can do about it.

Doc.

[Savet]

I may have missed it, but what is the price of one of these kits? This is amazing.

[DocsMachine]

I may have missed it, but what is the price of one of these kits? This is amazing.

-This actually needs a bit of clarification. I'll try to be brief.

I quoted a starting price of $1,000, plus extra for any additional work, like milling, pump kits, etc. for everyone here.

Problem is, that's the same price I started quoting after I made the first one in 2004. (And really, I haven't made any since around 2010.) Thanks to various economic issues since '04, and especially much more recently, means that the already-undervalued original quote, was worth even less. (By a full third.)

I am not what anyone might call a brilliant businessman.

Long story short, I'm sticking to the original quotes I've given. But anything after this current batch of eight, will start at $1,500. (In other words, the photo above of the completed gun- everything you need, that's not off-the-shelf-'Cocker, to make a complete Vee-Twin, would be $1,500.)

And of course I'm a custom shop. You want it different? I can make it different. A couple of these are going to be midblocked/halfblocked, and I can even make it vertical if you want.

Doc.

[Savet]

That's very helpful and that pricing is a lot better than I was expecting.

[woouulf]

Sent a PM with email info .Just the normal,standard,default pump kit will do...

[latches109]

This was epic to watch come together so fast! Great work Doc!